CCW badge?

Legal & Second Amendment
41

The big issue for me is still the legal defense after a physical self-defense incident. It makes us look like we’re trying to impersonate police officers - I know we’re not, but a prosecutor will definitely use it against us. :frowning:

If it was required by the state, then that negates the purpose of concealed carry. I don’t need or want anyone knowing that I carry a gun. At the range, you can probably assume I have a gun on me. Outside of the range, people can guess, but I won’t tell them one way or the other.

One of the big guys in our training area asked me the first day I started at the USCCA where I carry on my body. I told him. He gave me grief for telling him. He said no one needs to know that! I still remember that conversation as if it was yesterday. I’ve discussed where I carry on my body on here to share my experience with others. I do look like my picture a bit, but unless you’re targeting me, the information on here won’t be readily associated with me in my life. If you’re targeting me, you’re going to have issues. :smirk:

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42

My philosophy is I never want to give a zealous prosecutor anything he can use against me with a grand jury or during a trial. One of the reasons I never carry restraints. I do however, carry a FAK and blowout kit everywhere.

“Ladies and Gentlemen of the Jury, it is obvious that he believed himself to be a police officer. Besides a gun, he also carried a fake badge and handcuffs. The defendant was looking for someone he thought was a criminal and shot someone because of that belief.”

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43

^^^ This right here. 100% of this.

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44

Good thing my handcuffs stay with my uniform then!

This is actually something i had thought of prior.

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45

@Hasaf just finished CCW quals today, CCW badges were discussed by THE Sheriff, CCW badges are illegal in CA and possession of one is grounds to have your permit revoked.

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46

This post deals only with California Penal Code

This isn’t a jab at anyone here, and again to repeat, I do not have a CCW badge. The last badge I wore was issued by a County and I returned it when I left. However, when people start saying “It’s against the law,” I like to look at the actual law.

Remember, I am not an attorney, just an overweight has-been that now teaches at a middle school.

I also snipped a bit off the bottom, but I left enough for anyone to find the actual section in the Penal Code. Among other things, the snipped portion covers things like security and productions.

The Italicized portion, in B(1) and B(2) looks pretty damming, but the bold section in B(2) leaves a lot of wiggle room. So much wiggle room that it is not really clear that it is illegal (and I am not going to go through the case law to see that the courts have really decided). I do see enough there to tell my friend, that I mentioned in another post in this thread, to get the recommendation from his issuing agency in writing.

Again, this is the California Penal Code and is only a cursory search.

PART 1. OF CRIMES AND PUNISHMENTS [25 - 680]

( Part 1 enacted 1872. )

TITLE 13. OF CRIMES AGAINST PROPERTY [450 - 593g]

( Title 13 enacted 1872. )

CHAPTER 8. False Personation and Cheats [528 - 539]

( Chapter 8 enacted 1872. )

538d.

(a) Any person other than one who by law is given the authority of a peace officer, who willfully wears, exhibits, or uses the authorized uniform, insignia, emblem, device, label, certificate, card, or writing, of a peace officer, with the intent of fraudulently impersonating a peace officer, or of fraudulently inducing the belief that he or she is a peace officer, is guilty of a misdemeanor.

(b) (1) Any person, other than the one who by law is given the authority of a peace officer, who willfully wears, exhibits, or uses the badge of a peace officer with the intent of fraudulently impersonating a peace officer, or of fraudulently inducing the belief that he or she is a peace officer, is guilty of a misdemeanor punishable by imprisonment in a county jail not to exceed one year, by a fine not to exceed two thousand dollars ($2,000), or by both that imprisonment and fine.

(2) Any person who willfully wears or uses any badge that falsely purports to be authorized for the use of one who by law is given the authority of a peace officer, or which so resembles the authorized badge of a peace officer as would deceive any ordinary reasonable person into believing that it is authorized for the use of one who by law is given the authority of a peace officer, for the purpose of fraudulently impersonating a peace officer, or of fraudulently inducing the belief that he or she is a peace officer, is guilty of a misdemeanor punishable by imprisonment in a county jail not to exceed one year, by a fine not to exceed two thousand dollars ($2,000), or by both that imprisonment and fine.

. . .
(Amended by Stats. 2014, Ch. 514, Sec. 1. (SB 702) Effective January 1, 2015.)

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47

Criminal Justice is all about making the price for violating high enough to discourage most people from taking the risk and punishing those who are caught.

Personally I think it could be a valuable tool to help police and reduce the chances of them accidentally misidentifying the good guy with a gun as the bad guy.

It’s another case where I"m more than happy to err on the side of caution.

Catch those violating and punish them harshly.

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48

No state issues them so there would be no way to do a study to evaluate the outcome.

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49

As I suggested, the ID need not be worn outside your clothing. It would be produced and made visible only during an incident to make you more easily identifiable by police arriving on the scene, particuarly in the event it’s an active shooter scene where they need to be able to distinguish between good guys and bad guys pretty much instantly so they can seek out the bad guys.

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50

Back before we had concealed carry, open carry was our only option. One day, a guy got kicked out of a store for carrying, by police
. He drove a crown Victoria that had a CB antenna on the trunk. They gave him a lot of static about trying to impersonate an officer just from his car. I don’t see an advantage to the badge. I do see a lot of disadvantages.

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51

Soooooo many reasons this is a bad idea. Just don’t, please don’t. Oh my, why people think this is a good idea… I have no idea. Not a single reason I can think of for carrying one.

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52

I seem to be coming late to the party and have not read every comment yet so my apology if this was already brought up.

I do NOT want the government to issue me anything more than I am already required to get from them.

Gun ownership is a right. Driving license is a privilege.

I should not have to ask permission for the first nor pass anything other than what is stated in the Constitution and Bill of Rights to own one (or more).

The second, the government can make rules (although in my opinion they have overstepped in task). They (the government) already think they need to protect me by forcing me (with threat of forfeiture) to put on a seatbelt while in a car (no let’s not get into that debate right now save it for a different time and thread).

I already think there is too much government involvement in our day to day lives as it is. More government issued anything means more government involvement in our personal lives (and more information being collected on its citizenship).

I’m I paranoid? Perhaps I am but, I also have looked at history and see us as a people making the same mistakes of the past.

More often than not, Laws are being written and passed more as a response to an incident with pressure being applied to an elected official during an election year than anything else (my opinion with no data to back up my claim).

My point is this, we as a nation need to stop letting fear drive the government and help insure common sense prevails.

We need to learn from past deeds (both good and bad) and move forward with that knowledge to make things better not more restrictive.

I have officially stepped off the soap box for now.

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54

I’ll listen to the sheriff - don’t need or want my permit pulled

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55

I strongly agree. If your issuing agency has given specific instructions, it would be foolish to go against those instructions.

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56

I understand your thoughts here, @Wildrose. I just think criminals would replicate them so quickly that they would just end up causing more of an issue.

If someone’s already committing a mass shooting, they’re not going to care about the repercussions of wearing a fake label/sign that says they’re a legal person if that gives them a chance to get away.

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57

They aren’t going to worry about a badge either since few of them have any desire or intent to survive the shooting.

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58

Miss Zee;

I am sorry to drop in on your message here. Just a small note that in a Conceal and Carry class that I received in training that a Badge outside of being law enforcement and certified to wear that badge is wrong. Thank you very much.

Through many hours of training, repetition of all training, with all the fundamentals of a firearm, and worry of falseness and lies. Please note that that badge is false.
The companies that drag people through their incomplete training, misled people.
The USCCA training is a great place to start on a grand path and believe that if you give USCCA and research, a chance. You will see why. I want you to stay out of prison or worse. You can get better training out of a cereal box, but please give our USCCA or a company that is equal in making sure your prepared. The companies that try to make you believe that their training and that BADGE is going to give you a protective shield that will defend you is FALSE.

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59

So, I’ll admit it…I Googled ccw badges after reading this thread. And holey crap! You guys weren’t kidding, these look legit! I don’t see in what world this would be considered a good idea. Yikes!

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60

If it looks like an LEO badge there’a a very good chance that at some point it will get you in trouble and at a very minimum will draw attention from police you’d rather not have.

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61

@William_H drop on on any thread any time :slightly_smiling_face:
To be clear, I’m not in favor of a CC badge, I think they’re a bad and dangerous idea.
I am a USCCA instructor and we advise against using them.

Yep, me too… had to go Google them. 100% agree with you on that!

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