First the laws of self defense vary a great deal from state to state.
Second, you’d have to consider the reasonable man concept. That being would any reasonable person in that same situation use a firearm to defend themselves .
Third, did the driver exhaust all means of escaping before deadly force was used?
Fourth: property damage can be repaired, but the cost of criminal or civil litigation could ruin you financially, and you could still be sent to jail, lose your job, and be separated from your family.
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As Mike said, depends on the laws… but it might just depend on the politics and especially the politics of the prosecutor and Judges.
I would say this is a justified example of a self defense situation, they have already smashed the back window, there are more than one, and you are in grave danger… however, there is room to maneuver your vehicle. (Note: One reason to NEVER pull all the way up on the vehicle in front of you at a light or in stopped traffic… always leave a gap for Escape and Evasion E&E)
In this video, it appears the vehicle can reverse a distance, at least to move the vehicle. If you hit any of the terrorists attacking you, it is still self defense… and if you can get to the shoulder, drive down it to safety.
If you can not escape, using your firearm would be justified and would win in court as long as you can express your fear of grave bodily harm or death from the terrorists.
But, I am not a lawyer… and I am not Commiefornia
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Multiple assailants, yes
Smashing windows and attacking and engaging and disengaging multiple times, yes
No ability to retreat? Could he back up? Could he go between other vehicles to reach the shoulder and escape? Perhaps.
But, the terrorists are illegally and unconstitutionally blocking the road, they are denying the rights of all those in their vehicles, and they are violent and aggressive, and any reasonable person would fear for their life…
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Multiple assailants, yes
Smashing windows and attacking and engaging and disengaging multiple times, yes. He did not smash a window and retreat… he kept coming back.
No ability to retreat? Could he back up? Could he go between other vehicles to reach the shoulder and escape? Perhaps. However, the road is being blocked, illegally. There is limited options to escape…
But, the terrorists are illegally and unconstitutionally blocking the road, they are denying the rights of all those in their vehicles, and they are violent and aggressive, and any reasonable person would fear for their life…
It does not matter if the person in the vehicle was unharmed. If someone shoots at you and you fear for your life, the fact the person shooting at you misses every time does not negate the fact you are under threat of death and may defend yourself.
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He departed and returned several times while smashing windows… on both sides of the vehicle. There were MULTIPLE assailants … and limited escape routes if any.
I think the drive could express clearly he had a fear for his life.
There is one thing. Never get too close to the vehicle in front of you, leave room for escape… a key counter terror security measure… and when in trouble, run and bust through road blocks, be they vehicular or personnel.
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Most carry with JHP or SJHP and not FMJ for defense.
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He smashed windows, left and came back and smashed more… on both sides of the vehicle. I think the time frame of the situation would be sufficient time to be attacked, have fear for your life, and realize there are multiple attackers, with the one being the primary threat.
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Oh yes you do need to leave room so you can escape. I do it all the time at a red light or while I’m stopped in traffic.
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Indeed.
Security and counter terror.
Always leave room in front in case … you never know when you need to gain some momentum to push through road blocks or stopped vehicles… or to simply turn the vehicle and accelerate away.
Always watch your mirrors even at traffic lights and stop signs.
Always good things to remember.
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@Kevin29, I do, and most people do. However, in this day and age of ammo shortages, people will carry what’s available.
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Or as most of us do, at least one knife, and possibly a tactical flashlight.
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While true that there is some ammunition shortages, I would think most would not use their self defense ammunition at the range and would keep a supply. I have several magazines worth, and use the FMJ for practice.
But, in times of armed violent insurrection, FMJ works.
TAKING A BIG CHANCE… we are responsible for everything down range, if you hit someone other than your target. You will go from HERO TO ZERO, fmj will go right through them and beyond.
Perhaps you misunderstood.
I am NOT saying fire indiscriminately.
I am also speaking of open armed conflict, rebellion, break down of civil society and the rule of law. Been in countries during rebellion, insurrection, and armed conflict. It is not pretty.
My comment was NOT to suggest FMJ would be the optimum choice for self defense or to suggest as I said before, indiscriminate firing.
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@Kevin29, you and I are of like mind, but I have a question.
Regarding the JHP that I use in my EDC, I don’t carry it forever. After carrying for 2-3 months, I shoot it and put fresh JHP in my weapon. I do this because I’ve read accounts of law enforcement officers who carried ammo too long and had misfires as a result. In this scenario, at some point I could run out of JHP’s.
Do you do this?
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I usually wait until I have carried at least one year. Anything less, and I consider it a waste of ammo.
I still also have ammo that is 20 years old and it fires.
I do switch out the rd that is chambered as each time I clean it and chamber a rd, it does push the bullet into the cartridge case further and may cause a misfire, but other than that, I keep and carry the same ammo for at least a year, sometimes longer.
Every 2-3 months in my opinion is far too often.
I used to be an armorer and an ammunition inspector. Could I be wrong? Perhaps. Would you feel comfortable with carrying the same ammo for 1 year? That is perhaps more of an issue. What you prefer.
But, ammo will not go bad in 2-3 months.
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I’m retired LEO also and I have pepper spray that I carry with me just in case. Agree 100 percent with @TStheDeplorable. Always good to have another option.
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I hear you brother I don’t miss the job but I do miss the comrades and people I worked with. If it hadn’t been for 911 I may have stretched it out to 30 years instead of just 20.
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