As for the OP: the woman is wrong. She knew the rules of entry yet refused to comply. She was trespassing and should have been arrested once she resisted. So much of the problem we have in this society today falls back to lack of respect of proper authority. If the cop was wrong, the department has a complaint procedure to deal with it. Worst case scenario, you file a lawsuit against the dept. Escalating isn’t likely to work to your advantage.
Sometimes cops make mistakes, they’re human. In the moment may not be the best time for that argument.
@OldSchlPunk… Tho’ I agree with you that she was “probably” trespassing, I don’t see that as sufficient for the treatment she received. I don’t trust police departments complaint process… they are only there to clear the cop (unless there is overwhelming evidence they cannot sweep under the rug) and the police bank that you will not be able to afford an attorney for a lawsuit. My problem with “sometimes cops make mistakes, they’re human”-- a cop’s mistakes kill innocent people (not George Floyd or Breanna Taylor), but truly innocent people-- 225 in 2019. Its not like a locksmith, or burger flipper… it is very serious when they make mistakes and very seldom are they held accountable for their mistakes… that is much of the reason for the riots and protesting we see.
So in essence we become sheep, comply, comply, comply? Isn’t this what , for generations, we’ve been fighting against. A police state?
So she didn’t have a mask on, it’s not like she was burning down a Target store, or firebombing a police station, or outright assassinating law enforcement, my bad, thats justified and endorsed!
Dude you read me all wrong and I’m not sure you reply justifies a reply. If you’d get off you conspiracy theory high horse and read what I wrote. No one is asking you to be a sheep. Laws are in place, trespassing being one of the oldest. If someone came to your house and did something you didn’t like you can ask them to leave. Same thing happens when your playing in someone else’s sandbox. As far as a police state, the officer probably didn’t even want to be there . However some civilian/ school administrator involved him. Just like every other instance when someone calls the police. He’d probably rather be anyplace else but right there dealing with that stupid crap.
I’ll admit I hadn’t previously watched the video. Now I have. Typical video of the sort. You see nothing of what lead up to the confrontation and hear none of the conversation. Pretty useless. How this guy sides against the cop with this little information is beyond me. Couldn’t see if the cop has a bodycam. If so, where’s that video? Might give us a bit more insight.
I still say that if she knew that masks were mandatory, she had the option to leave if she didn’t like the policy, otherwise, she runs the risk of arrest for trespassing. And yes, arrest in front of her family.
I’m sensing a bit of FTP from some here. I hope I’m reading this wrong. I don’t know Ohio law but am guessing it isn’t too different from WI. We need the cops to do the job they have been hired for, otherwise we will continue to have chaos.
I don’t like the mask mandates any more than the next guy. When I go to the grocery store that has a 4x8 sign right outside the entrance that says masks are REQUIRED for entry, I have to play the game unless I want an interaction with the cops. Just the way it is right now.
From what I could see in the video, this woman comes across as an ignorant, mouthy, immature know-it-all. As does her friend/whatever, who easily could have been arrested herself for putting a hand on the officer.
And in 2019, do you know how many interactions the FBI estimates police had with citizens? The estimate is 50 million but could easily be over 120 million. Yes, 1 innocent death is too many. What were the circumstances of those 225? I doubt I’d be able to find that information. Honestly, as bad as that number is, I’m almost surprised it isn’t higher with the number of interactions per year.
In the past, there have been big problems with cops being covered for, especially in our biggest cities. There will never be an excuse for that and I suspect the practice has gone down drastically. Hopefully I’m not wrong. It seems there is more transparency and accountability in the past 2 decades or so.
@OldSchlPunk: I can tell you every interaction… but I won’t. the internet is there for all… I will tell you a few… Wichita, a man was swatted… the police showed up as the man was watching tv with his family and one cop didn’t like his actions (walking out the door) and shot him, Houston Tx, a BLACK sgt-- Gerald Goins, got a no knock warrant using lies, busted in a WHITE 60yo couple’s home and murdered them. He and his Chief, Art Assaveda, lied and covered it up for 2 months until the neighbors took the shooting to the local media who broke it open, Goins was finally charged, but a year and a half later he is still out waiting trial. Hoover, AL, a shooting in a mall (not mass shooting, just a guy pissed at another guy) a CCW was ushering kids and moms to safety when a cop came in-- not identifying himself and shot the CCW in the back 3 times. He and his PD tried covering for him for 2 weeks until the witnesses forced the crooked PD to admit the “mistake”. FT. Worth Tx, a young gal watching her nephew when the police showed up not announcing themselves, she got her pistol and was shot dead. LA, a store manager killed when the poorly trained cop supposedly aimed at a suspect and missed killing her. Minneapolis (not George Floyd-- a 42 yo white woman reporting a possible rape in progress), Detroit, Dallas, Mesa, AZ, Omaha, Des Moines, Chicago, NYC, Greenville SC, I could go on, but you get the idea.
It bothers me that you would make such a comment without knowing me, nor having research the facts first. I don’t care if there are 10 billion interactions with the police-- these “accidents” shouldn’t happen and the officers should be help responsible. YOU and I would if we “humans” made the same “mistakes”.
Cops are cowards these days-- I was LEO in the mid 70s. I had a 6 shot revolver, 6 extra rounds in my pocket,l no body armor, hand cuffs and my radio was in the squad car. I can remember 3 hairy situations-- I pulled my revolver once. I don 't know of any cops who could handle that today, If a bad shooting by a cop is OK, then a bad shooting by a civilian should get the same consideration.
I guess I’m tired of seeing bad guy win and good guy lose! I would rather see the looters, barn burners and most of all the cop shooters, treated the way she was treated! It’s also mandatory to wear a seatbelt, I’ve never seen law enforcement rip a person out of a car for not wearing one. Couldn’t he have just cited her, given a ticket and everyone enjoy the rest of their day. If a guy is trespassing on my property and I ask him to leave he does not comply, I call 911, I’m sure, we’ll maybe I’m not sure how it will go, guess it could depend on trespassers state of mind. But on my land alone, if I don’t want him there he’s trespassing. If I’m correct seatbelts are a law, mask are not the law. Our country seems to be sitting on a razor.
No offense intended, sorry. I have a lot of respect for almost everyone that posts on this site, there are a (very) few though…
Like I said, maybe I was misreading some of the posts, I haven’t ever before gotten a FTP vibe here and I thought it very odd.
I have lived in fairly rural areas almost all of my life, the little time I have spent in big cities brings me to despise them. I admit, I tend to give LEO’s a bit of leeway when it comes to doing their job. Maybe that’s because of the more rural living and that we see much less corruption in the local departments. Not saying it doesn’t exist, it’s just harder to hide in a small community.
Most of your examples are inexcusable. Some are out and out corruption. I don’t know what to say about a swatting, the cops go into a situation that doesn’t exist. You’d like to think they should recognize that they’ve been had but in the moment, I can see how SHTF. Accountability is a must though. Bad shootings are bad shootings and shouldn’t be tolerated. That’s not to say they won’t happen. Anyone covering up a bad shoot should also be prosecuted.
Don’t you think calling cops these days cowards is a bit harsh? The environment has got to be much more stressful than back in the '70’s, don’t you think? Never having been LEO, I wouldn’t know, just my impression. I think it takes someone really special to do the job. I can’t imagine how the job doesn’t interfere with your personal life or how you keep your personal life from messing with your job performance.
Departments are having a harder and harder time recruiting quality people. Unfortunately sometimes they have to settle for someone they wouldn’t have just a few years ago and hope for the best. Far from a good situation but staffing still needs to be met, wouldn’t you say? I don’t have numbers but I would bet this is where at least some of today’s problems come from.
Aren’t we all, brother!! The problem, though, lies with the Democrat Governors, Mayors, DA’s and Police Chiefs that are allowing (encouraging?) this bullsh$t to happen/continue. With that half of the government refusing to uphold the laws of the Country or State, nothing will change soon.
Mask mandates are not law, as seatbelts are. Trespass is law, and by not complying with posted rules on public or private property will run you afoul of such a law if you don’t comply or leave when asked. The pathetic video in the OP doesn’t show us what led up to this action, you can infer that this happened before the video started rolling or you can look at it as an unjustifiable action by the cop. We don’t have all of the facts to make that call. Bodycam video would probably clear some of this up for us.
@OldSchlPunk, I am not one of those easily offended, however there are a couple of statements that push my buttons, and “police are human, they make mistakes” is a big one. They make mistakes that they shouldn’t be making (they are supposedly highly trained), like killing people that have no criminal contact with police and murderers with badges like Sgt Gerald Going of the Houston police department, who, knowingly murdered a 60yo white couple and now, almost 2 years later, is still running free WITH his pension. That is not only wrong, it is criminal and the chief should be facing criminal charges of his own… My last comment on the subject ( I think) is that I am not a cop hater nor defunder!!! I am a critic! The police have brought on most of the current events themselves after decades of abusing innocent people. Departments and police unions are guilty of covering up for criminal and inept cops. In my opinion, the police cannot be trusted to protect me nor mine-- I’d rather do it myself and just let them do what they do best… bring the yellow tape and report forms.
I appreciate that we can dialog like mature people. I respect you and your comments.
Ladies and Gentleman - please remember the point of the USCCA Community and our Community Guidelines.
Name-calling and general nasty behavior are not allowed in the Community.
We don’t all agree on everything, but that’s OK. However, your disagreements must remain respectful.
*** Point of clarification, two sets of comments were removed. One for nasty behavior and one for being off topic (the religious comments were off-topic in this thread).
The posts you deleted were not “Name-calling and general nasty behavior”, perhaps they got off topic, but I take issue with you calling them “Name-calling and general nasty behavior”.
I bet that is an automatic post after a message gets flagged… it is probably just assumed that it has been flagged for those reasons since it is probably the most frequently flagged offense.
I hear you and fully agree on the comments on unions and upper management. You also have to lay a big portion of the blame for the mess on the desks of these mayors. Then there are the DA’s that won’t prosecute because of their own twisted ideology. All too often, these problems are coming from one side of the aisle.
Unfortunately, the honest guy on the street is the one taking it in the shorts.
Great conversation. Gives me more insight and other ideas to consider…never a bad thing.
