USCCA and Washington State

Dawn-I am disheartened to hear about the position of Commissioner Kreidler. I have sent an email to his office to discuss his position. There certainly is an insurable interest that is benefited by this product. In the event of a questionable incident involving a Member it would also follow that uninsured parties also benefit from the Member having such a product.


Hey Mitchell, welcome! That’s a very interesting point.

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I have too many years of dealing with Plaintiff Attorneys (now retired). 98% of them would want insurance coverage available for Defendants to pay for compromised settlements of disputed claims and/or Court Judgements. Bankrupting a Defendant is a Zero Sum Game. The Defendant’s assets are diminished (spent) by providing a vigorous defense. Even if the Plaintiff prevails in Court the Defendant would have little assets left with which to pay a Judgement. In other words, the Plaintiff’s attorney has to pay to prosecute the case and, if there is no insurance, has little chance of collecting a Judgement for his clients.

It would seem to me that the Washington Trial Lawyers Association might, in this case, be an ally in convincing the Insurance Commissioner to reconsider his opposition to Membership Benefits of the USCCA.

Just thinking out of the box…


That’s a strong case for Strange Bedfellows and decidedly out of the box. Ilike it.

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Kreidler will be up for re-election in 2020 let’s make sure we put someone in who supports our rights.


Is it possible for us to see the email the commissioner sent that is contradictory? Interested parties would like to see it.


By the way this was their response to my inquiry.


Well, the Commissioner’s office response is very interesting, @Jared2!

Are you asking about the documentation the Insurance Commissioner sent to the USCCA?



I have received the same canned response from Ms. Kelly at the WAOIC (png copy attached).

I have requested that she forward copies of the documents sent to USCCA by the OIC.

I will report the response.

Dawn edited the photo to remove @Mitchell’s email address.


Dawn-I have received another response from Ms. Kelly. She had referred my Public Disclosure request to the department that handles such requests.

Just another thought. There is an Excess & Surplus Lines Insurance Market in WA State. While it might involve some additional broker fees, has the USCCA looked into this approach? It would, unfortunately, turn into an “insurance product” but as I understand it, would be beyond the reach of the OIC.




Thanks for the update! I know the team that is working on the legal aspect of helping our members in Washington is watching this thread :slight_smile:

They are an amazing group with lots of great ideas. I don’t know if the one you stated is in their list, but they will see it here.

PS - I hope you’re OK with me removing your email address from the photo you posted. I want to make sure your privacy is protected as much as possible.


Thanks for respecting members’ privacy! I am a retired Insurance Professional. I have chosen NOT to renew my License so I will be also not have to worry about a government official threatening my livelihood (again!).

I do see the Member Benefits as a plus for any concerned citizen who chooses to carry a firearm to protect his or her family. I also am familiar with how the Plaintiffs Bar operates. I see the Member Benefits as providing a Public Service.


Yes @Dawn. If it is possible I would like to see what the commissioner has said to USCCA.


What I can tell you is that we have received and responded to a Notice of Investigation issued by the State of Washington Office of the Insurance Commissioner.

Their office may have an internal policy that responds to any question about an open investigation by indicating they are not under investigation.


:open_mouth: :angry: yeah they might. That makes me mad though… seems just the sort of information the taxpayers of WA ought to be able to find out about.
There could be a case for subterfuge if the subject of the investigation hasn’t been informed yet (I say could not should) but since you’ve been informed, why do they get to lie to the people they’re responsible to? :angry:


Lying seems like a bad policy from a government official, possibly illegal. I say we vote the tyrant out at the end of his term in 2020. I’d encourage anyone who reads this to file a polite but firm complaint with Mike’s office with a friendly reminder that we know he is up for re-election in 2020.


Please note, I’m not saying they’re lying. That type of policy might be something they do regarding open investigations.


@Dawn you aren’t, but I certainly am accusing them of lying. If they are investigating USSCA while saying that they are not I would argue that’s the exact dictionary definition of lying. Not trying to be disrespectful or argumentative with you. I am simply hell bent on making so much noise that the Mike can’t continue to ignore what the people want. Thanks for your active reponses on this thread! I hope we will still be doing business 172 days from now when my plan will or won’t renew depending on how this goes :confused:


You definitely weren’t being disrespectful or argumentative, @Jared2! I just wanted to make sure I wasn’t misspeaking or being misleading.

With emotions running high, I want to be as clear as I can with what information I can share.

Thanks for understanding, Jared! We love having you in the USCCA Family!

You’ll be welcome in the Community, no matter what happens in 172 days.



I received the response from the Commissioner’s Office as well as the response from Counsel representing USCCA.

As it appears that the USCCA will not be able to offer the full benefits in Washington State, how would I notify Member Services to cancel my membership?