I know there are a lot of talking points about the events that took place at the church in MN. I’m curious, from purely a defensive/protection standpoint how YOU (meaning anyone who responds) would react of you were in the congregation. Also, I’m not trying to engage whether the actions are justified or not, just simply how would you respond in the event you were there.
I thank your input.
G-d only knows.
I wouldn’t run away form them, that’s For Sure.
To be clear, I am head of security at a church where I attend. I think it’s a good conversation for people to think how they would react/respond to this type of situation.
There was no way to respond to them other then telling them to leave. They were vocal but not violent.
Call the police
You are in a Church I would petition the Lord for discernment. Best answer I could come up with.
…based on the mob’s actions. They could be yelling, shouting obscenities, etc., as long as they’re not a threat, none of my business.
If I could leave safely with my wife and whoever’s in my “circle” at the time, I would. No one knows I’m carrying except for my family.
THERE IT IS! Preventing me from disengaging THEN we have a problem. You want to Sh!t Stir? I don’t like it but apparently in MN you are more than free to do so. Also apparent there is NO LAW in certain parts of our Country at this time.
I’m not prone to violence…Stop Laughing! But this is why I believe in my heart that there are other forms of Self Defense before the breaking Leather. If someone gets in my face and starts ranting Leftist BS I WILL leave them pissing themselves on the ground.
@Matt_W You’re job as Peace keeper of the flock is just that. If they are being non violently Stoopid call the man (hopefully your neck of the woods have Badges that believe in Serving and Protecting). Upping the violence doesn’t help anyone’s cause and fuels the Left’s derangement.
This is getting out of control and if these Lefty’s don’t watch it some of them will start getting their Arses handed to them. They are Unhinged and getting bolder. Check6 and up the Sit. Awareness.
This may get worse before it gets better
Agreed!
I think this pot needs a little stirring. If one looks at the problem as a challenge the problem goes away. Always look on the bright side of life. My 2¢
In that instance, the term problem and challenge have the same revalence, the issue is still the same, and requires the same solution.
Here is another data point to think on with this topic: the perception of a potential threat.
In many states (if not all) there are laws that would allow for “the perception of a threat to be dealt with in a fashion that stops the perceived threat.” I’m no lawyer, but is it possible, for a congregant to feel as though there was sufficient action taken by the “protesters” to merit a more forceful response? With all the violent “protesting” happening all over the country, would that not create a very real perceived threat to the safety of the congregants?
Not a lawyer either. The answer is yes, there are many things the prostester can do to merit a more forceful response. The main thing to do is de- escalate. Do not provoke or entrap the protesters and you should be fine. Maybe you could give a for instance scenario, as to what would cause you to feel you should take more sufficient action.
Especially the older parrishoners, women and children. Likely confronting them and asking them to leave would incite them more. I don’t know what the “protestors” compromised of, nor the church members, so it would be difficult to assess that. However, safety of the aforementioned parrishoners is paramount.
Good point. To me a problem implies either no action or over reaction. A challenge implies taking the proper action. Hope that clarifies and is not a problem.
I certainly think it would. In Utah, I don’t need to wait until I’m injured before I can defend myself. If I “reasonably believe” me or others are in serious danger I can defend myself. To me an angry mob crashing the doors of a religious meeting and screaming in my face would have me reasonably believing that something terrible could happen.
From Here: Utah Code Section 76-2-402
| (1) | As used in this section: |
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| (a) | “Forcible felony” means aggravated assault, mayhem, aggravated murder, murder, manslaughter, kidnapping and aggravated kidnapping, rape, forcible sodomy, rape of a child, object rape, object rape of a child, sexual abuse of a child, aggravated sexual abuse of a child, and aggravated sexual assault as defined in Chapter 5, Offenses Against the Individual, and arson, robbery, and burglary as defined in Chapter 6, Offenses Against Property. |
|---|
| (2) | |
|---|---|
| (a) | An individual is justified in threatening or using force against another individual when and to the extent that the individual reasonably believes that force or a threat of force is necessary to defend the individual or another individual against the imminent use of unlawful force. |
|---|---|
| (b) | An individual is justified in using force intended or likely to cause death or serious bodily injury only if the individual reasonably believes that force is necessary to prevent death or serious bodily injury to the individual or another individual as a result of imminent use of unlawful force, or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony. | |
|---|---|---|
| (4) | Except as provided in Subsection (3)(a)(iii): |
|---|---|
| (a) | an individual does not have a duty to retreat from the force or threatened force described in Subsection (2) in a place where that individual has lawfully entered or remained; and |
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| (b) | the failure of an individual to retreat under the provisions of Subsection (4)(a) is not a relevant factor in determining whether the individual who used or threatened force acted reasonably. |
|---|---|
Highly subjective but good point!
In CA, I probably would need to see blood first.
California Penal Code 422 PC defines the crime of Criminal Threats, making it illegal to willfully threaten death or great bodily injury in a clear, specific, immediate, and unconditional way that causes the victim sustained fear, even without intent to carry it out. This can involve verbal, written, or electronic communication (from AI)
Same way I would anyone who was creating a disturbance on private property, ask them to leave, when they refuse tell them they are now trespassing and notify the police to come and take care of the disturbance.