I love these two.
A suggested related video.
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I follow them also!
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Just posted that 3 hours ago. 
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Oh sorry, didn’t see. I’ll take my post down.
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@Forensic_Wow Great video, and can you imagine in a good self-defense case looking like it’s going positive then the anti-gun lawyer asks one little question, “Have you had firearm training?” Boy, answering that question just opens up a whole new can of worms. What a way to throw a monkey wrench right into a good self-defense case and take into another direction that will hurt the case.
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Yeah I think it’s ridiculous, you go out and do one thing that’s good, that “anti-gunners” say they’re okay with, and then flop and go full power against it.
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This is a very tough subject for me. I don’t carry…yet. I was denied a permit because of where I live. The current Sheriff of my county is being investigated for corruption in issuing CCWs, so it’s the same status quo as always: only the politically and financially-connected will get a CCW. I applied and even took the required CCW class to show good faith. I even had and still have a clean record. I don’t drink, smoke or do anything considered a health risk. I am my handicapped mother’s caregiver, which includes taking her to clinics and other places. I am planning to take defense training classes primarily for pistols. Today was another reminder that I need to carry for not only my safety but for my mother’s, since I am her caregiver. After taking her to a clinic yesterday we went to a gas station. As I was about to pump gas, a homeless man came up seemingly out of nowhere and right up to my mother’s window. She gets frightened pretty easily, so I immediately got in the car and raised all the windows and locked the doors. My mother was adamant about leaving but I told her I was observing to see what that man would do next. He was going up to other people to ask them for money, including people who were just arriving. He eventually left and I resumed pumping gas. But what if…? That was the question I had on my mind afterwards. I already went through a terrifying experience where I almost used my shotgun to defend our home from three ex-cons (4 including the driver) trying to do a home invasion 4 years ago, and two other less dramatic incidents. The first experience definitely prepared me and helped me to be more determined in defending my life as well my family’s. I carry less than lethal tools including a folder knife, but I know I’d be at a major disadvantage if a threat had a gun. If and when I do carry, it’ll be after taking at least one defense training class. Unfortunately, this is the best some of us can do if we plan to carry a gun for our self defense and for our loved ones. I’d rather argue my case in court and be able to demonstrate that I did everything to be responsible such as taking defense classes. The other alternative is having to forever regret that I wasn’t able to effectively defend myself and especially my mother because I didn’t have a gun. Today was another reminder that I just can’t put off training and being responsibly armed indefinitely.
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I would see what the consequences of carrying a firearm without a license to carry are, and make the judgement. In Ohio before constitutional carry, carrying it concealed was a misdemeanor, but carrying in a car is a felony.
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That was an excelent video and was worth watching and it did bring back th mind that the onlytime tha DA had a conference with me was in a conference and I had my USCCA Atty with me,there were 4 people in the room and the DA asked if he could record the interrogation,at which time I looked at my ATTY and he verified that it was ok,then the DA asked how the person approched me and I said aggressive,at which The DA stood up and raised both legs up one at a time in the position of stomping,and I said no but to me his steps were aggressive, then he asked if I had killed people while I was in Service,and then I told him that I did what i had to do to survive the mission,Then he asked what I had to do on my missions, and once again I said what ever was required to survive, then the Da released us and at the next court hearing T DA dropped the charges with full rights and said the jury would rule SD in the case,but would like to mention that the court bailiff and on my one night in lock up,they put me with the Trustees,i was treated very well by the LEO’s and the judge and they even provided a chait for me to sit in in frot of the judge and a headset so i could hear, and a friend that was taking me to the Hearings said the LEO’s said it was all BS
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I have noticed that very often in self defense cases, the victim/defender does not take the stand at all, which would avoid that question even being able to get asked.
Tom Grieve has spoken about this in the ask an attorney series in the Protector Academy on the USCCA website. His take is that he would very much like for the prosecution to open that door as seeking out and receiving training is a good thing and all the things it points to regarding your responsibility and due diligence etc are positives.
Training also increases the likelihood of there being a “good fact pattern” to your self defense case which is crucial. Trained you are more likely to make better choices (more quickly) and handle your firearm better in the first place.
Training is good, unequivocally
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I think training is vital and with a good lawyer should work to your benefit in most cases. The one time I could see it working against someone is if a well trained individual makes a very bad decision that goes against their training.
I could imagine a scenario where a jury might have some sympathy for an untrained person who panics in a threatening self defense situation but they might hold a trained defender to a higher standard. Even though that trained defender is likely facing the same fear and adrenaline dump for the first time as well.
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that was the first time I had a confrontation,and all I can say is my motor training did pay off,i did not even remember even drawing my weapon until It was over,which is what you train for and m adrenaline was never present ,I was not shaking and the weapon was dead on and steady. but the only reason the person is alive to day in that after the 3rd stop and his foot was raised and I even noticed it was his left foot fixing to complete his continued forward movement, and that is when I lit him up with my on demand laser between the eyes and that is when his eyes changed and the wild look in his eyes and he realized that i was serious,as they say the eyes will telegraph the next move and i will always believe that the laser saved his life and saved me from a trial
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If it came to the point where my training or lack of training was called into question I would rather have to defend my actions based on knowledge and training rather than be labeled a moron who bumbled into a situation unprepared.
Analyzing and recognizing use of force situations is a positive skill set. Knowing the laws in your state is key to your defense.
Your attorney should be able to use your training and experience to your benefit.
Remember much depends on your ability to “articulate” your reasoning and subsequent actions.
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I spent 25 years working as a court reporter in various jurisdictions and it is my observation that defendants who take the stand in their case do themselves more harm than good. The most blatant example was a politician indicted on bribery charges. At the end of the prosecution case it was my opinion and the defense attorney’s opinion that the prosecution had not made their case. Unfortunately, a weak-willed judge didn’t have the intestinal fortitude to dismiss the case with prejudice. The really stupid politician (is there any other kind) insisted over his attorney’s strong advice, even informing the judge that he had advised his client against doing so) took the stand and convicted himself out of his own mouth.
I haven’t reviewed the tape yet but if it talks about getting hammered on cross examination by a prosecuting attorney it shows little actual courtroom experience.
The prosecuting attorney cannot even comment to the jury about your failure to testify. Even though the Rittenhouse prosecutor tried to do that, he was prevented from that by the judge. Actually he should have been referred to the bar association for knowingly violating the rules of procedure.
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Last month’s issue of Concealed Carry Magazine had an article about legal advice. I suggest everyone impressed with this duo read it.
They keep talking about defendant’s on the witness stand. That makes me wonder if they have actually tried a shooting case. If they allowed their client to be on the witness stand I wonder what the outcome of the trial was. Is their client still walking around a free man or is he in jail waiting transport to state prison?
These two seem to have gained their legal training at the Ally McBeal School of Legal Dodgery. It is the rare skilled, experienced defense attorney who will allow his client to be subjected to the cross-examination by even a newbie in the DA’s office. In an earlier reply to this thread I cited a case from my 25 years of sitting in court where the brain-dead politician decided to match wits with a very skilled cross-examiner. Even though he had presented a very weak if not non-existent case on the prosecution’s presentation, he tore several new one’s in the defendant on cross. The guy not only mounted the scaffold, tied the knot in the noose and placed it around his neck, he actually pulled the lever to drop himself through the opening. Instead of listening to the question and answering just the question he had to blab and blab and blab on and on digging the hole deeper and deeper.
Once the defense says, “no further questions, Your Honor,” his client is naked in a minefield with a battalion of Russian Katushas zeroing in on that field.
I can sum up their long meandering talk-a-thon by saying "Get yourself an experienced shooting defense attorney who has a string of acquittals to his record. Pay close attention to what he tells you to say and do. Follow those instructions to the letter. No latitude for deviation. You are not in a system seeking justice. You are in a professional hardball game and you have never ever played the game. You are a lamb in a slaughterhouse and your defense attorney is your only savior. Do not talk to anyone about the case. Let me repeat: Do not talk to anyone about the case. Except for your wife and your priest, the DA can subpoena anyone to testify against you. Even your parents can be subpoenaed and must testify. If for some insane reason you find yourself on the witness stand, listen intently to the question. Analyze the question before you answer. If you have the slightest feeling that you missed something, ask to have the question read back. Listen carefully again. Think again. Answer the question as briefly as you can. Yes; No; I don’t remember; I don’t know should be the extent of your answers. Do not go beyond the briefest answer possible.
The most dumbfounding deposition I ever reported was an engineer who did exactly that. Answered the question asked, not the question he thought the attorney meant. I was almost rolling on the floor in laughter. The dumbazz attorney didn’t catch on to what the engineer was doing. Two and a half hours later and 150 pages of testimony and he had nothing at all and was shaking his head wondering what had happened. And the fun part was the engineer was just a disinterested witness, not an interested party at all. He had a fun afternoon playing games with the attorney who never even realized he was being had. I could only imagine the attorney had caused him to miss doing something he felt important to him and the attorney insisted on HIS date and time for the depo rather than accommodating an independent witness.
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Don’t say you’re sorry
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After the meet with the DA,at the next court as to proceed with the court and jury,the DA dismissed all charges and further said that jury would rule Self Defense in the case and dismissed with all rights restored
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As a retired member of the law enforcement community I have received training in shoot, don’t shoot, and self defense methods. Now the two, out of thousands of other attorneys decide that training is not a good idea. The purpose of a defense attorney is to protect us from these accusations and show why they are unreasonable. Shouldn’t they be working on disproving these allegations of manufacturing a scenario. As they said their job is to “keep it out of court”. In their defense of an individual the reality of the situation should be made clear and the judge’s statements should be refuted. Even judges are not omnipotent. A good attorney can stand up to a judge and show him the error of his statement. as for training, isn’t this a case of damned if you do, damned if you don’t. The prosecuting attorney knows you have had training if you don’t have training you are wrong, if you do have training, you are wrong. And as for de-escalating, your attacker isn’t going to de-escalate. he will not listen to reason. He is out to harm you and whoever is with you. I would not spend lot of time trying to de-excalate. It could get you killed. If the attacker is not responding you have to react. If I have to select an attorney I want one who is going to defend me, not one that is going to support the judge.
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