I have no issues carrying my P365 SAS XL(yes, it’s on an XL frame with the X trigger😎) AIWB w/o a manual safety with one chambered. My 1911 I need to install a Ambi safety on it before I carry it(lefty) and get used to muscle memory working the safety on/off when drawing/reholstering.
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Not sure who your calling a “Tactical Timmy”, but comments like that are not conducive to learning and civilized discourse amongst community members. A sense of humor is a great trait and communications tool, but not while name calling in denigrating others for their choices, especially when they are proven, sound and progressive. Those little belittling sound bites only serve to stop folks of lesser experience/knowledge from exploring and adopting excellent methods of SD because some perceived expert doesn’t think it’s “cool”.
Also, folks don’t “tend” to blame the manufacturer when they hurt themselves. In many cases, I’d even say most, the lawyers that immediately get a hold of them after they do something, that in kindness we’ll call “less than smart” (like carry a Glock inside a purse with probably no protection for the trigger) immediately coach them to blame the equipment in a effort to get a quick settlement from the manufacturer.
I’ve been present during several ND by folks with Glocks (and quite a few other guns) and as an instructor I get exposed to a LOT of folks of different skill levels handling firearms. Every instance I have personally witnessed was easily explainable and usually even demonstrable as user error. EVERY instance of an ND that I have personally witnessed was a user violating the second rule of safety by keeping a finger on the trigger and in some cases preventing clothing or an object from pressing the trigger of a Glock in a manner that will cause a negligent discharge.
Throughout my life I’ve personally met three LEOs who shot themselves in the leg/foot while trying to holster Glocks with their finger still on the trigger. All three of them are drawing “disability” pensions and when you talk to them the proudly wear the badge of “shot while on duty” like a medal… which sounds heroic until you talk to their peers and dig a little deeper and find out that they are also part of that other statistic “LEOs shot with their own gun” and while they think they “got away with it”, they are the subject of everyone they knows jokes behind their backs. One of them actually was passing himself off as a “firearms instructor” to unsuspecting people, even though he had no qualifications or certifications at all.
I’ve been around Glocks (and I AM not Glock lover, until very recently my EDC was some sort of a 1911) for a loooooooooong time, playing with them since they were the novelty “Tupperware from Europe” gun. I have NEVER seen or heard of an ND that was not fully explainable and user caused. If their guns routinely went off on their own would they be where they are today.
At the end of the day, if I’m sitting down with a gun pointed at my valuable body bits I can not think of a better choice than a Glock in a well built kydex holster. And AIWB carry is a very valuable and sensible way to carry a firearm that is meant to save your life.
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Another though on this subject. I’ve personably had to break an inordinate amount of “experienced shooters” out of the BAD habit of sweeping the safety off their 1911s while unholstering their gun. A person that has that bad habit is a negligent discharge waiting to happen, especially appendix carrying.
Your external safety comes off as your finger reaches for the trigger and you already have made the decision to shoot. So I don’t agree that just carrying a gun with an external safety is the solution to safe appendix carry. As usual good safety habits, proper techniques and training trump equipment “fixes” pretty much ALL the time.
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“Think lightly of yourself and deeply of the world”
― Miyamoto Musashi, A Book of Five Rings: The Classic Guide to Strategy
Appendix carry isn’t new or “progressive,” whatever that is supposed to mean. 
“The ability to cope with the unforeseen is the measure of a man.” (LTC Jeff Cooper) My 2 cents on every topic goes something like this: He who manages risks the best wins!
This article in Guns & Ammo by Keith Wood (2016) actually mentions the fanaticism of AIWB proponents, but you are manifesting it for everyone to see. Whenever I run into people who get super-animated in their defense of an ideology, tactic, technique, or tool, I know from experience and education that their insecurity is what truly drives them so hard to try and convince others that it actually becomes dysfunctional. And I also know that people who use the word “progressive” tend to accuse anyone who disagrees with them in the slightest or refuses to take them with the utmost seriousness of the very things they know themselves to be guilty of. Weirdly, I’ve been a professional in the firearms world for more than 4 decades and I have witnessed precisely 2 NDs. 1 while goose hunting and 1 on a duck hunt. NEVER on any sort of range, especially not a training range! Just sayin’…
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BIG pet peeve of mine I see all the freakin’ time on civilian (including LEO) ranges! Thanks for pointing it out.
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Well thank you for taking the time for making a whole lot of ignorant assumptions about me, and making this huge effort at shoring them up with memes and “philosophy”, what is only your total lack of knowledge of my background and myself. I guess you are trying to show me as some “super-animated fanatic” and somehow “insecure” of my knowledge, and you’d be absolutely wrong on all counts, but even that is meaningless in the context of this forum.
For what it’s worth (not much) I’m just an open minded and fact oriented individual. I don’t take second hand anecdotes and Internet stories as fact until verified. I only act on personal knowledge, training and the advice of folks that I KNOW have better information and experience than me. The rest is just noise…
I do find it fascinating that you try to illustrate stuffing a bunch of 1800s firearm in some worn out leather belt, for a studio photograph, as some sort of an illustration of how old the concept of modern AIWB carry in high quality kydex holsters is. I guess the made up Fred Flinstone’s foot powered car was a good precursor to the Corvette too for you.
Anyway, I’ll leave the info I posted to stand on its own. Folks can just make up their own mind. Thank you for your comments.
Also, you obviously failed to read the whole article which was actually pretty well thought out and written by a guy who fought against appendix carry for a long time until he actually adopted it. The last two paragraphs for the rest of the folks interested in facts vs Internet fluff:
“Appendix carry may seem extreme at first glance but, when you break it down, it makes a great deal of sense. Keeping your handgun where you can easily access it, defend it and maintain control of it are key advantages of AIWB carry.
As with any method, training and practice are key. With a well-constructed holster designed for AIWB use, appendix carry has a lot going for it. Try it, and you may change your mind.”
Now I’m done. Thanks!
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I never post something I didn’t read in its entirety. I don’t quote people unless I know quite a bit about them and their body of work. And I don’t get offended by sarcasm on the Internet, especially not on my employer’s website where I am dealing with paying customers. SMH
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I’m sorry, do you work for the USCCA? Or are you just using unclear language to refer to me in some veiled manner? Tough to tell but, if it is the later:
1- The USCCA has members, not customers. I’m a proud Elite Member of the USCCA. I’m also employed by Delta Defense and I’m also a USCCA certified firearms trainer amongst other qualifications.
2- My employer, Delta Defense, has trained me and makes sure I know what I’m talking about AND they have certified me to teach what I know. That keeps up the quality and consistency of our training in which we strive to teach the best, most modern methods and techniques of armed self defense. If we were still teaching techniques/information from 40 years ago we would not be very useful to our members. I’m also entitled to have my personal opinions based on my experience and training and I’m encouraged to do so. In many cases these conversations helps me learn something new, or it reaffirms what I already know. In either case it’s a win.
3- My employer also allows me the freedom to have conversations stating/defending my positions, not just here but everywhere on Social media. We believe in the first amendment as strongly as we believe in the second and the rest of the Bill of Rights. It specially applies when those conversations lead to disagreements. ALL progress starts when folks disagree with the status quo.
I believe I have done nothing on this thread but state my point(s) as courteously as I can so other folks here can hear different opinions and make up their own minds as to what is the best information for THEM. If in doing so I have offended you in any way shape or form I apologize, that was never my intention. But, in reviewing everything I’ve posted, I am clear that I am not in need of changing my position on anything I’ve posted on this thread.
And so it’s clear, I’m absolutely not offended in the least. Actually there’s not shred of emotion on anything I’ve posted and other people’s opinions do not offend me in the least. I hope you’re not either.
Have a great day.
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@Enzo_T Dude. Let’s not get off into the weeds of legal fictions and what not. SMH
DD = USCCA for the purpose of my comments. USCCA sells memberships. Under the USCCA brand and using the USCCA mailing lists and what not, DD sells several products. If you don’t realize that…wow! I’ve purchased some in response to marketing emails. They also sell training and certifications, which are technically services under the same logo and auspices. ALL of the employees who work all of these things I mentioned are employed by DD, best I can tell. So you can drop baffle them with BS smokescreen.
I didn’t come at you. You took a run at me, apparently because you have no sense of humor about your chosen method of concealed carry. I’ve merely poked fun at you a few times since, because you are soooooooo freakin’ serious and humorless about AIWB. And I’m a bit worried about all these ND’s you say have happened in the classes you teach, but that’s a totally separate issue.
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Ok, I’ll try one last time, but I’m really out of time/energy on this one, not even sure why I’m still on this circular discussion.
“DD =USCCA” is wrong information for ANY purposes regardless of you personal perception and it should not stand unchallenged. I’m just stating facts that are not, as you incorrectly stated, “BS smokescreen” “weeds” or “legal fiction”. Some folks don’t understand the relationship between the entities and the members. Truth and facts are always better than misconceptions and fiction.
So here are a few facts:
I post on this Community as a member of the USCCA, just like everyone else here. Identification as an Instructor, Employee etc is just a courtesy afforded to anyone that has such titles on this site. Anyone can agree or disagree with me, and I can do the same.
I didn’t come at you. I’m only trying to correct what I believe is poor information being posted in the Community. That and just that. For whatever reason I seem to be the focus of YOUR attention, c’est la vie. I guess I can’t change that. You do have it right in that I am definitely serious and rather humorless when it comes to safety and handgun (or any other deadly force) defense so you do have that right. And making sure folks get the best information on the subject has been a lifelong passion of mine and I’m lucky enough to work for a company that feeds that passion and supports me.
Please do not be worried about “all these ND’s you say have happened in the classes you teach”. I never said that, but it’s almost amusing that that you try to paint it that way as some sort of veiled, what, insult?. Well, sleep tight, no worries should be had by you about the state of my classes. I do wish you’d stop trying to read past what I type specially to unsuccessfully try to misrepresent it. Anybody with basic reading comprehension reading both posts knows that your comment is not true and it is nothing but trollish behavior in your part.
In any case, I really have better things to do so please by all means go ahead and have the last word on the subject if you must, everything we have posted can stand on its own to the other folks reading it.
Have a great day!
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The proverbial “last word” you requested…
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I consider myself an intermediate shooter and that is exactly how I train. I index my trigger finger straight down the slide and point my finger at the target until the decision to fire has been made. It seems to help me come on target quicker.
I have read enough of your posts that I have respect for your experience and insight. Now you have me rethinking if I should reconsider what I thought was a good practice to take the thumb safety off during the draw. I am currently a 4:00 right hand carry. Would you please elaborate on when to take the thumb safety off on a 1911 draw? It just seems like taking the safety off and moving the finger to the trigger is too much jostling around at the same time?
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Thank you for your kind words.
The short answer is It should not be. You strong hand thumb should live on that thumb safety and the movement needed to disengage it is minimal.
The long answer is disengaging the thumb safety on a 1911 should be the last thing that happens right before your finger presses the trigger, almost one fluid motion if practiced enough to master it. The actual position of the firearm at the time is secondary to this. During a defensive draw your gun should be ready to shoot the second it clears the holster and the muzzle is oriented to the target. You do not need to wait until you are at full extension.
In other words, you can start shooting when necessary from any position all the way from one handed retention tight to your body, through High Compressed Ready, to fully extended. Flipping the safety back on should also be an immediate reaction to you deciding you are done shooting as soon as your finger comes off the trigger. On a 1911 the two motions are intimately tied and should follow one another in either direction.
What is not desirable is for the thumb safety to be disengaged while the gun is still in the holster or in the process of clearing the holster, especially since many shooters also have the bad habit of putting their finger on the trigger as soon as they acquire a grip on their gun. Let me know if you need further clarification. I’d be happy to illustrate with pictures or video via private message or email.
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So what about pistols that have no safety at all? Does this mean they’re inherently unsafe? Or is it that 1911s are designed to be used with a safety while another gun may be designed to be safe without a safety?
N.B. I do know there are two schools of thought on this topic, but the question seems to fit within this thread.
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Great Question!!
Great Answer. Thank you
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I can’t think of any modern manufacture pistol that is inherently unsafe. I can load a 1911 without engaging the safety, lay it down cocked and unlocked on a table pointed at a group of baby lambs and come back 20 hours later, and all the baby lambs will be alive and well. I do believe we have shooters executing unsafe practices or habit, or worse yet, believing they can execute flawlessly during chaos with no training or practice. Reality is that you can make just about anything work for you if you are committed!
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This seems like a really inefficient technique. A motion that would take a pull of one finger turns into a two step process, even if down simultaneously. I always swipe my safety off on the draw.
That being said, I’m moving away from Manuel safeties on my carry guns.
(Edit: I missed your other response about resting on a 1911. My shield safety is a small bit with nothing to rest on 
. Safeties on the striker fire guns don’t really make me feel better anymore now that I see they do nothing as far as the internal workings of the guns me are often a design after thought).
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I was cocked and locked yesterday.
Cant beat a 1911. Actually it was the first time I carried it. I had to remind myself there was 3 safeties: manual lock, handle safety and the holster. I’ve gotten very confident carrying. Not stupid but knowledgeable about my guns safety features.
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