It means it will change the statistics.
I think you nailed it. If training is mandatory, then it should be free.
Funny, I donāt recall anyone arguing that we canāt send advanced weapons to Ukraine until they are all properly trained.
4 Likes
What statistics will change?
What is the āitā in your post that will cause the statistics to change?
1 Like
The statistics that will change is that less innocent people will be killed or maimed because of the proper training.
1 Like
What article?
2 Likes
I think @Shamrock has previously reconciled them perfectly well. Firearms training is a mandatory part of public instruction ā like personal finance, health, driving, civics. Everybody gets it; informs the populace; infringes nothing. The stipulation that it be without cost or effort is silly ā neither education nor citizenship is like that.
Firearm ownership and enjoyment is completely detached from training. Optional ā like a checkbook, car, reproduction, or voting ā everyone has knowledge; everyone has choice, nobody is required. Simple.
But, I suppose, impossible. 
2 Likes
the one you wrote about not needing firearm training.
Would you mind sharing the current statistics you are referring to?
Maybe the statistics that show the rate at which people are killed or maimed due to lack of training in the states that, for decades, have not required it?
I canāt quite figure out what stats or information you are seeing, or basing your opinion on
So, when you say āthe statisticsā will changeā¦what are those? Can you link them?
1 Like
I will be having friends over so must stop for now. All you have to do is watch the news. How many innocent people per week are being struck by wild shots. People that know how to shoot properly would not have trouble of hitting their targets. You cannot tell me that you believe that people that has never had proper training is not more dangerous than people with proper training. If that is not the case than why do all law enforcement and the military require recruits learn how to shoot. Enjoyed chatting with you but must go. Hope you have a wonderful day.
1 Like
Any proof of that, i.e., stats? The CDC death rates proves you wrong. NH proves you wrong. I am willing to debate facts, not feelings.
2 Likes
People being injured by people committing illegal acts has ZERO to do with law-abiding citizens and firearm training nor safe handling of firearms - read the news stories - become informed. An emotional reaction is not rational - by definition.
2 Likes
From what I see, 0 innocent people are shot per year by stray shots from lawful gun owners legally carrying concealed.
Would you mind sharing your examples when you get the time?
I AM telling you that in the real world of actual factual reality, there is no, 0, nada, evidence that required training has any effect on injury rates whatsoever.
And of course the burden of proof is always on those who want to restrict others, so if you want that restriction, it is on you to show why.
2 Likes
Ok. I thought you meant an article I shared.
Yes, you misunderstand. I think every responsible gun owner should choose of their own free will, to seek out the most quality training they can. But, I do not believe in a mandatory requirement to exercise a God given, Constitutionally protected right.
Iāve thought a lot about a āwhat do you proposeā question, so Iāll add it here, in regards to the school shootings. Iām a firm believer that gun free zones are easy pickings, for a mentally disturbed individual hell bent on committing an atrocious act like what happened in Texas. I would allow concealed carry in schools. For the teachers, if they are a licensed carrier, I would offer an incentive of school district paid membership in the organization of their choice. USCCA would be my choice, but, leave it up to the teacher for which one they chose. That way, there is incentive to be more highly trained.
4 Likes
I promise that if it were allowed, some LEA with jurisdiction over any given school would find it in their budget to provide training to teachers and staff. I bet firearms instructors would do it unpaid
6 Likes
A local firearms instructor does 1/2 price CCW classes for teachers from time to time around here.
6 Likes
It is just as impossible as impressing on people that RKBA is constitutionally protected, unlike
For this reason, the analogy doesnt hold.
Besides, there are lots of people whose personal finance is in shambles, who get into worst kind of car crashes, dont know boy from girl, and votingā¦dont get me started.
1 Like
Thatās awesome!
1 Like
Appreciated. Great points William400 . I was motivated to choose the most accurate firearm I could use. Thereās a film āA Walk Among the Tombstones,ā where a man struggles to cope with his bullet having ricochet, and the accidental casualty.
Interesting dichotomy. Why does someone choose to become a school-teacher? How many of them ever thought about carrying a gun, while teaching? Odd scenario. Though Iād support they have the right to do so ā for the sake of the little ones
āTalking about religion and politicsā. Old saying ānot to do so at dinnerā; So I hardly ever do, not my thing. Not everyone is lucky to have a religion. Not everyone belongs to a pollical party. I donāt envy those. Thatās why I often have to āsit on my handsā; When anyone yells, my ears hurt.
IDK, maybe Iām a realist or deal with what I know to exist, have proof of, and if it feels like the right thing. Laws on the books; now thatās something I can understand; Not like a law, then itās my duty to try to change it, but Iāll follow the law no matter what. If I canāt change it, maybe itās not my place to be, but seek somewhere else where Iām more welcomed.
For me, thereās something about maintaining a carry permit which connotates earned, not a āhand outā.
Sometimes I think about all carry permit holders, and how God forbid they ever encounter a mass shooter, he/she might have to decide, does he/she intervene or not. I cannot decide for that person of course, it would be their own personal decision. But I sure have a lot of respect for anyone who has a permit to carry because they might have to make that tough decision one day. They take a big risk if they ever have to use to defend life, as the judicial system will scrutinize them. Not everyone would take the risks they take.
Just because training does not guarantee being error free, is not a reason not to train.
Iāve never seen the country more serious about āchangeā, than I have this past week. Itās like a freight train, though of course, slow moving, but itās moving. I think itās gonna happen. I just hope we in the 2A community, get a fair say in the changes which are about to occur over the next 1-5 years.
Hope to see more of your posts in these forums. Carry on brother.
3 Likes
Which is the problem.
It is supposed to be a Right, not a privilege.
6 Likes
@William400 , there also people thinking like you. Iām one of them.
I spent so many time on similar discussions that I decided to only read and analyse.
I just wanted to let you know, you are not alone here!
Itās my privilege to be here and read your posts.
2 Likes