Permitless carry aka Constitutional Carry is GOOD

I just wanted to put that out there.

I understand a lot of gun owners and carriers live in states that have long required ‘training’ in order to obtain a “Mommy may I” permission slip from the government before exercising the privilege to carry a firearm…so the change to “yes, it is a RIGHT to keep and bear arms, and it is being infringed less now” can be, well…a big change.

But it’s a good thing. I promise. :slight_smile:


yes it is a good thing. but, training should still be acquired by the carrier. if not for legal at least for safety sake


I must disagree that training should be required.

But I tend to disagree with all infringements, including that one.

Training should be recommended. My opinion.


I’m not saying it should be required I’m saying it should be sought out by the carrier to further their own knowledge and safety

thats what I meant


It looks like I may have seen the word acquired and read it as required. lol

I gotcha now :slight_smile:


I agree. Florida has gone to constitutional carry a little over a month ago, and as far as I can tell, the sky has not fallen, gunfire hasn’t erupted in the streets, and, well, everything seems just about like it ever was. Hopefully people carrying are seeking out training, and being safe and educated. As for me, I’ll still keep my license current because of the benefits it brings.


I have mixed feelings about that. While I agree with training not being a mandated part of gun ownership, that also means there will be people who won’t get the training, just because they don’t have to, don’t want to pay for it (or can’t afford it) etc.

We all know a gun is potentially dangerous to the untrained - and those around them! Imagine being around someone who doesn’t even know the basic safety rules of gun handling (maybe you don’t have to imagine!). Imagine the tragic accidents that will happen as a result. You can strongly recommend they get training, but some people just won’t follow recommendations until something terrible happens, and sometimes not even then.


…like interstate travel.


This won’t happen.

This already doesn’t happen.

There are many states that have allowed concealed carry for literally decades with no training requirement…and this doesn’t happen.

It’s okay. I promise. :slight_smile:

We don’t need to violate the Second Amendment and infringe on people’s supposed Right to keep and bear arms because we are afraid people will be unsafe if we allow them that Liberty/Freedom.


I’ve mentioned this before, but, the state I grew up in:

  • Was shall issue permits, is now Constitutional carry
  • Has not required training for the shall issue permit, or Constitutional carry
  • Minimum age to get a carry license is 18
  • Bars are legal for carry
  • College campuses are legal for carry
  • Signs mean basically nothing
  • Almost nowhere is off limits for carry
  • Been that way for literally deces

And it’s not a problem and there are other similar states. :slight_smile:


There was a time when training was a normal way of life. How can I explain that? When people carried rifles in the back window of the pickup truck it was an excepted practice and the young ones new the safety precautions to be taken. How should I say, the handling of a weapon was “public” knowledge!

I introduced firearms to my children and grandchildren at a very young age. Do they respect firearms, of course they do! Do they train/practice absolutely. Are they safe, absolutely! Are they afraid, are their friends afraid, nope! They teach them!

I can’t think of a great analogy for this, but let’s try taking away cars and stop training/teaching/practicing. We allow a 16 year old a permit to get behind the wheel of a 2600 pound vehicle.
Imagine if we never let them understand the mechanics of the most deadly piece of equipment on the planet! COMMON SENSE driving practices.
It needs to be brought out into the public personae that when handled correctly Guns are as safe as your car! Even with all the training and permitting and licensing, more people kill more people with a car than my rifle will ever kill in a million years!
The public, voluntarily increases their awareness and training when it comes to owning a car, why don’t we apply the same rules to firearms.

Now don’t get me wrong, I don’t want the government involved, but our communities of gun owners, kinda like the secret club! When you’ve learned the four passwords ( rules of gun ownership ) you’re accepted into the club. When you turned 16 you got into the “Drvers Ed” club!
I propose “Firearms Education” club, not so much as training, but an acute awareness and responsibility!

What was it really like in the old west. Ever hear of a twelve year old experiencing an “accidental discharge”? Kids as young as 8, learned how to shoot. They weren’t afraid of the gun, they were afraid of the outlaw with a gun! In today’s society we are afraid of the good guy with a gun! Makes no sense!

I hope some of this made sense, if not, I’ll need more coffee!


I’m going to counter this argument that with people without training, they have misconceptions about the law.

Had a conversation the other day and people are like, “It’s easy to get away with murder in Ohio you have stand your ground.

When I explained I have USCCA his automatic response,

“That’s for when you screw up.”

Or I’ll talk to people oh I’m going to take this and this class, they’ll look at me and be like oh you don’t need that it’s legal now.

People are very dismissive of training. They don’t need it, so they don’t want it.


Sorta makes you feel like an obsolete relic, doesn’t it? They have their truth, and don’t want to be confused by your facts. That is, until the Judge tells them that ignorance of the law is no excuse for not knowing what it contains or what it means or how it applies to them – and then the Judge slams the gavel NOT in their favor. At which point it’s always too, too late. Grandma used to say, “a hard head makes a soft a$$.”


People with training have the same misconceptions.

Some states, such as FL to take a headline example, will literally take 30 year old out of state hunter’s safety as proof of ‘training’ for a permit, which does exactly diddly squat for understanding of state law.

Just say no to infringements on the Right to keep and bear arms.


What of people who don’t carry, who only have a firearm for home defense?

Should they require a license with state training that teaches them all of the laws also?


I think that shooting and daily carry are like almost any other skill based activity out there. Some will take it seriously and get training just because it’s their personality to be good at what they do, be safe, and be competent, but others will never want to bother with training and never take it seriously. The serious folks join groups loke USCCA.

I’ve been boating in one way or another almost my whole life. When I was a kid my dad took me to a boater safety course. Years later, when I moved to coastal Florida and decided to get into boating again, I knew that I really wanted some significant training. The ocean can, obviously, be incredibly dangerous, and boat crashes are very often fatal. So, I sought out the United States Power Squadron, who were basically the premier boating education organization since about 1910 or so. I got very involved with the group and the education, even becoming commander for a while. The sad thing is, they’ve all but disbanded because no one wants their quality training anymore.

Anyone born before 1988 can, in Florida, jump in a boat and head out into the busy waterways and shipping channels with, literally, ZERO training. There are as many rules of navigation as there are on the road, and idiots blasting around in high powered boats with no clue about any of them. The people that are young enough to need a license are getting the bare minimum “class time” in an on line course, probably not retaining any of it, and hitting the water.

You can mandate training, but you can’t fix stupid and can’t make people who don’t want to take it seriously.


I would say a good part of that is because most of the training required in permit mandatory States is incredibly minimal. The majority of those States primary goals are to limit and infringe on rights with the side benefit of bringing in some extra cash. Truly making anyone safer isn’t on their agenda.

I’m not for mandatory training but I think it would be nice if the States that are passing these new constitutional carry laws included some funding to promote training and public service type announcements. There are a lot of misconceptions about the legal use of force for self defense. It would be good to clear those up. As I’ve said before I think the best way to do that would be to make firearm safety and legal self defense use classes mandatory in schools. The 2A says you can’t infringe on the right to own or carry a firearm by requiring training but it doesn’t say you can’t require kids to have safety training in order for them to graduate.

I agree the sky won’t fall by opening up constitutional carry to everyone. But a lot of that is due to the fact that the vast majority won’t suddenly start carrying on a regular basis and the vast majority of the small percentage that do will never have a reason to pull their firearm to defend themselves.

More law abiding citizens with firearms is a good thing but having as many new and old firearm owners as possible be as well trained as possible is even better. Plus it may help reduce some of the bad publicity we get from the rare ignorant firearm use cases the anti self defense main stream media like to bombard us with. Unlike the anti’s illogical argument that taking away everyone’s right to self defense is worth it if it saves just one life, getting as many people as possible as well educated and trained as possible could actually save more than a few lives without costing countless more lives by rendering millions of people defenseless.


Before I was “trained” in order to get my CHP, was not “untrained”. My father taught me firearm safety at a very young age, so young I cannot recall not knowing. I had a spring-action bb-gun when I was five, and first shot my father’s .22 at somewhere about 6-8 years old. I shot a pellet rifle just about daily as I got older. I did not get a handgun (NYS resident), until I moved to Virginia as an adult, and only because I missed target shooting, and there was an indoor range not too far from my house.

When I took the CC class, and other classes, including the one to get my NRA instructor’s certification, I can honestly state I did not learn anything about firearm safety that I did not already know. The training was good in a way, in that it affirmed what I already knew, and now I could claim I was “trained” and have “proof” of training.

I believe this is a big issue people do not understand. Not having “proof” does not mean one does not know firearm safety. Everyone I know that carries already knew how to properly handle firearms. A number of those were friends and family that I personally taught. A couple of them asked me to teach them firearm safety and how to shoot, just because they were interested in carrying and had no prior knowledge. One frequently went with me to the range, probably about a year, until she was confident enough to go by herself, and then later got her CHP.


But they want you to be trained…


That’s good to hear. Just remember there are many people who did not grow up around guns and whose only exposure to them was what they saw on TV or movies,and/ or maybe being on the wrong end of a robbery or shooting.

People like me, for example.

For someone like me, knowing that they are totally ignorant about guns and especially gun safety at first is essential, otherwise there may be accidental/negligent discharges pretty much as soon as that person so much as holds a gun (they won’t know to check if it’s loaded, point it in a safe direction etc., because they didn’t grow up with guns). For example, there are pictures of me holding my first EDC, and even though it was fresh out the box with the gun lock still on it, I had my finger on the trigger. I knew nothing about the Finger Off The Trigger Until Ready To Shoot rule - imagine if it had been loaded.

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