LFI Massad Ayood told a similar training story. That is why I carry a Hyfin Vent entry/ exit wound pack
I actually re read this thread from top to bottom. The final takeaway is that sometimes bad guys stop when you shoot them, sometimes they donât. As CCW carriers with limited access to ammunition (1 mag mebby 2) it is incumbent on us to be able to evaluate the shots that we HAVE taken and adjust fire as needed. That may be pelvis, head (assassin drivel aside) or more to the chest. That is really simple to say, however, when the feculent matter hits the rotary oscillating device it would be prudent for us to have trained in more than one capacity than something that is proving RIGHT NOW to be ineffective.
I recognize that there are different levels of skill across this board. Some here consider it a good day to keep all shots on an 11" x 17" target, others are ripping the center out of a 2" dot with room on the edges and everywhere in between. If you are of the former it will serve you well but more practice is in your future. If you are of the latter I challenge you to engage multiple DIFFERENT targets in DIFFERENT locations in the same magazine.
Nobody can predict how they will react in a gun fight. Even those who have been in one or more than one cannot predict how the next one will go. The one constant of most gun fight survivors is âI did what I (was) trained/practiced to do.â Practice to be proficient or better and then practice to be diverse in stopping power and NEVER stop honing the edge of your tools.
Amateurs practice until they get it right. Professionals practice until they CANâT get it wrong.
Seek to be professional.
Cheers,
Craig6
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Well said Brother.
I think (donât quote me on this) the true study of ballistics, shot placement and tactics began getting much attention when several FBI Agents exchanged gunfire with two well trained, well armed, bank robbers named Platt and Maddox (unsure if I spelled them correct). This occurred on the streets in Miami in the late 70âs or early 80âs. None the less, I appreciate this group and blog because it helps open the mind. Thank you all again.
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April 11, 1986.
Michael Platt and William Matix.
That was a tragic day - two agents died.
Fortunately the lesson had been taken and FBI decided to put more effort into training.
Thanks Steve. For the group, there are some documentaries on those events. One film on that real life story is âIn the Line of Duty: The F.B.I. Murders (1988)â. I could not yet find the film to rent it; Itâs sale price/cost was very high. You Tube has it free, but itâs very grainy. If one wants to skip to the scary shoot-out scene, fast forward to time 1:15.
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You are a gentleman, Burdo.
Oh, the number of times I have watched this and broke it down bit by bit. As well as, the Hollywood bank robbery. You need the proper tools to perform the proper job.
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This article talks about continuing to add more skills to oneâs tool box:
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I had no idea what kind of body armor was issued to the FBI agents back then
This is worth reading, too.
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This is a great thread with amazing stories, videos and articles.
What it has shown me is you keep shooting until the threat is neutralized and cover is your friend.
Being prepared canât be emphasized enough. That doesnât mean just shooting on the range. It also means being vigilant at all times and when something happensâŠyou have to have the him or me mindset. Always know your environment as well as you possibly can and look for cover and escape routes. We all need to being doing this before something bad happens. Not after it already has.
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I just posted a compilation of info on the 1986 Miami Shootout, for those who may be interested @Martin36 @Burdo @Todd30 @Jerzees @Steve162 among others
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This is a target we practice on.
This is a true vital organ target
This is an actual X-ray of a chest
If you go by the first target, would not you be shooting someone in the stomach?
I always say aim for center mass and center chest. Am I wrong?
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Interesting question.
I disagree with that being an assign thing it it smart today with body armor might be the only way to stop a threat.
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XRay doesnât reveal the vascular system.
The advice Iâve been given is aim between the shirt pockets (assuming the bad guy is wearing a shirt with pockets, I suppose).
Or aim between the nipples (assuming heâs a he and is shirtless?).
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Center mass between the armpits can be seen without an x-ray.
Center mass between the armpits can be found with a shirt on!