Disappointed in the USCCA

He is welcome to express his opinion, @Belmont. Training when you carry a firearm is critical for your defense and to keep others safe when you’re defending yourself.

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Hi Dawn your right i just dont agree i got my CCW permit without the training i had to take a hunters safety course when i was 16 i know when i need to use my gun i know I’ll hit my target

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I’ve come in contact it’s other vets that are anti gun. It’s not the fact that they are antigun that bothers me so much. It’s that their psyche has been twisted enough for them to espouse unconstitutional beliefs inspite of their oaths. Psychiatrically I can understand after combat the desire to not be involved with firearms. That’s personal. But to espouse it publicly in favor of legislation and unconstitutional controls is unconscionable imo. The 2A is in truth a control on government, not the people. :+1: I’m not disappointed because these are the conversations that must be had. Here or anywhere. Especially on a public platform.

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Being raised in a military family, I’ve seen those effects in both my father and brother. Welcome Home Brian, thank you sir. Took my brother over 20 years to rotate back to the world. I was honored to be there to help. Happy Veterans Day sir. You are loved, especially by those of us who have experienced the pain that you feel in a home setting. :handshake::heart::us:

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I equate the average CC/LTC course to driver’s ed we took in HS.

Nobody is really ready to be a competent driver after just completing DE and earning their license.

Even those who are skilled shooters and have been around firearms their whole life are not really going to be competent after just completing the basic CC course.

I see very few truly responsible people getting comfortable with carry until they’ve been carrying for several years and have had significant training above and beyond their CC course.

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Why is that? He recognizes that military service alone does not prepare one to be competent, confident, and to carry responsibly.

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Did anyone prevent you from improving your skills with a firearm or knowledge of self defense law?

Did you choose to educate yourself on the subjects most critical to anyone lawfully carrying?

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Unfortunately oaths have little meaning to many people anymore. They simply mouth the words because it’s required.

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I spent six years three active and three inactive and never fired a pistol or was taught to but I was taught to fire a rifle and was good at it. When my wife and I took our conceal and carry class I took the first night with her but didn’t have to because I had DD214 but I learned a lot at that class so I don’t think every veteran should get his permit without taking the classes.

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OK Gentlemen, I’m stepping in and calling a halt to the religious discussion in this thread as it is off the topic of the thread. If you’d like to have that discussion, start a separate thread.

The official USCCA position on training:
The USCCA acknowledges the importance of training and encourages all of its members to seek out and obtain quality training from knowledgeable instructors. At the same time, the USCCA believes that excessive government requirements for training are often used as barriers to entry for those who would wish to carry a firearm for self-defense. The USCCA believes it is the responsibility of every armed citizen to know and follow the laws concerning legal self-defense and that government agencies should make that information readily available to all citizens.

The Community welcomes all opinions as long as they’re expressed respectfully. I understand that you won’t agree with everyone someone else has to say - and that’s OK. But please remember, we’re all here because we want to improve our ability to defend ourselves and our loved ones.

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well said @Dawn :+1:

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@Sidecarr9,

Well, sir, the proper thing to do is “allow him” to exercise his 1st Amendment right here even though the USCCA Community is by no means government-regulated therefore they could take away the right of an individual if they chose too. (Here) Even though I’m sick of arguing that agenda on Facebook and it seems like peace is found here, but just let him make a few comments and don’t acknowledge it, and he will be gone.

So, I’m for the USCCA keeping him on here…
We want rights huh? Let us be open to that persons (Even though they can’t claim the first amendment here is guaranteed for them).

However, God bless you, sir, and thank you so, so much for your service and sacrifice…

Kindest regards,

Randall W. Anderson

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Thanks Dawn . I didn’t think it was gonna turn into a thread about religion when I started it , my point was it’s not good when gun guys start asking for regulations. I’m a Vet, I have my CCW. I didnt have to take the whole 16 hour class for it , but I did. And yes I do train and take classes , and I’m a firearms instructor . I don’t know why you would want a Ccw if your not gonna train for it , but that should be our choice not a government regulation . That was the point of the thread when I started it .

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LOL! I totally understand that the thread took a life of it’s own. :slight_smile:

I think it’s OK for a gun guy to start talking about training requirements. It shows that we as a firearm community have a variety of different opinions- and we can have productive conversations while supporting each other’s diversity.

He did say he was putting the Second Amendment discussion aside - I don’t think Rick Sapp is the kind who wants lots of regulations, but I don’t know him personally. I’ve just read a lot of his articles.

I think the biggest points to take away from this blog post are: learn and train even if you’re military trained

I want veterans, myself included, to stop relying on the training received a generation or two ago. Enroll in courses that will give a one-on-one advantage when the mugger jumps you from an alleyway or a drug addict hopped up on H attacks.

Don’t think that because you served once, many years ago, that you have done all you need to be capable of self-defense. We’re all getting older. Our eyesight isn’t as good. (Are you still effective if your glasses get knocked off or your hearing aid knocked out? Can you defend yourself after one whack on the nose?)

So, veteran friends, thank you for your service. Whether you were a cook or a gunner, you were one of the world’s finest. Now, let’s all remember Douglas MacArthur: Duty. Honor. Country … Training.

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Curiouser and curiouser. So, you would prefer that he be shut-up here? I understand it would not be a 1A issue, since this is not a government run site, but still… Does this also mean that I have to agree with everything said here?

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Agreed. I would be more disappointed with the USCCA for stifling conversation and becoming nothing more than an echo chamber. I find it interesting and educational to see what others have to say, even (especially?) if I don’t agree with them.

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I find this entire thread redundant. 2A says it all.
Yes I have a permit. yes I was trained in the Army on a variety of “man portable” arms. Yes my DD214 was all I needed in my state for proof of training. This whole thread is rife with concession of our enumerated right. My right to be armed is constitutional.

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I agree.

Do you think veterans should get trained beyond what they learned in the Military? (Not mandatory training, optional training.)

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My thoughts are is that my DD214 showed qualification for rifle, everything else was familarization. If you choose not to further your training, your choice. I choose to be prepared for any scenario that I may encounter.

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One of our members asked I edit this piece by inserting some paragraph breaks. So…
Holy Moly!

Just read this entire thread.

My dad was career military, and a reserve sheriff’s deputy and police officer. Taught me to shoot at age 7. First .22 rifle, followed by shotguns and handguns, revolver and semi auto pistols.

At age 21 I became an auxiliary police officer and sheriff’s deputy in Allegheny County PA. I consider my dad’s attention and instruction as valuable training. The SO provided organized training. My chief wrote a letter of recommendation to the Sheriff who issued me a concealed weapons permit. At that time there was no mandated state wide training requirements for a police commission, a security commission, and certainly not a CCW permit.

Nevertheless, I trained with a fellow Auxiliary Policeman and Marine Corps vet, not because it was mandated, but because we recognized its value…ditto martial arts. After 4 years active military service, 27 years Federal LE service, and 13 years contract court security service with the US Marshals Service, I still seek and continue to train. Certain skill sets are perishable and need to be revisited.

Do I think a DD 214 in and of itself is the only qualification needed to obtain a license to carry? No. I do acknowledge that it is a good starting point, and anyone who has performed military service has a leg up on those who have not. Notwithstanding the argument that having to obtain permission from the state to exercise an otherwise inalienable right is burdensome, if you don’t live in one of the states that has legislated “constitutional carry,” you are pretty well stuck with the laws as written in your particular state.

I support the states that recognize the value of military service, like waiving mandated training, issuance of licenses to those under 21, and reduced or no fees. I do absolutely support and urge my fellow USCCA members to continue to voluntarily train and hone those skill sets that may very well one day save lives.

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