Answered the Door with Gun in Hand

I would have A LOT of pain and mental anguish! :rofl:

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Is it in .45?

No?

No one’s home right now. Please leave a message at the sound of the beep.

Beeeep.

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Obviously the police made serious errors resulting in the death of another innocent person. However, we all know here that one does not do what this man did for that exact reason - and that is not that it was the police, but that opening the door without knowing what’s behind it, armed or not, is unwise. That is not victim blaming. As stated, even yelling “Police” and dressed as officers is not proof of claim.

There have been cases where the homeowner has shot police in “no knock” entries where the police were at the wrong home and were eventually acquitted.

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I DO have mental anguish and discomfort, can’t sleep at night, lack of sex drive, can’t eat, pee my self every time I hear a knock on any door… Can I get in on the cash?

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Not until you attend a mostly fiery peaceful protest. :grinning:

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I was at an event a couple of weekends ago where I got to shoot a Hellion.
I was impressed. Fun to shoot. Easy to manipulate and move around with. Reloading different compared to your standard AR but practice would make it simple.

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I’m saving up for one. I like to have all of the accessories before I purchase an additional AR platform. So that tacks on a non trivial amount of $$.

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Massad Ayoob has offered a construct of how we could better handle situations of answering the door. This is a framework, all that is needed is contextual language relevant to the current situation or conversation. But don’t open the door acting like Billy-BD. There may be someone Badder than you!

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An opinion is only an opinion. After reading the article, would I have gone to the door with gun in hand? No. If I would have been shot like that, do I hope my wife would defend me like that? Yes. Would I urge her to not, and get to safety ASAP? Yes. Should the cops have been there? No. ■■■■ happens…we are all human, and humans make mistakes. Groups of humans have made grave mistakes in the past, and at the time they all agreed or no one spoke up. Does that excuse what happened? Absolutely not. There should be consequences for the officers involved. Even mistakes with good intentions are mistakes, and we can’t say “oh, it’s ok. You thought you were right”. Just as we won’t be forgiven for collateral damage if we have to defend ourselves and someone innocent dies. We have to recognize that if the cops weren’t in the wrong place, everyone would still be alive. However, if the man wouldn’t have answered the door with a gun, he would still be alive. The cops were probably expecting the possibility of violence in responding to the call, which I feel they might have seemingly encountered. Not making excuses, just my thoughts on the article.

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If LE is at the door 911 is aware of it. They can wait on porch for the time it takes to verify that they are real and belong there.

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Where I live, it is incumbent upon me to know whether they are LE, etc., on official business. So, I must do what I have to do to verify this information, while keeping my gun close while not opening the door. We must know our state laws so that we may govern ourselves accordingly.

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I would say the badge camera footage 100% justifies the officers and 100% proves beyond reasonable doubt that the homeowner unlawfully presented an imminent deadly threat to the officers

Officers knocked (very reasonable, normal knocks) 3 separate times
Officers announced themselves as police 3 separate times
Homeowner the door and came out gun hand looking like he was imminently going to shoot the officers

Anybody have a different take?

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I edited this post.

I think there are a fair number of extremely incorrect statements made in this thread.

Let this be a moment of reflection about jumping to conclusions and unloading a preconceived bias into a situation without enough facts/evidence to go on.

I challenge those who condemned the police to watch this video and rethink jumping to conclusions in the future. And remember, this is exactly what the other side does for actual lawful carriers acting in self defense, guilty until proven innocent is not how this should be treated

Edit: It’s the thumbnail but here is as cap I took of exactly how the homeowner “answered the door”

He opened it and brought the gun up pointing at the police immediately

The police who had announced themselves as police 3 separate times and who were all in full uniform in the front yard

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I still condemn them for being at the wrong house and always will.
Yes, the homeowner was really stupid how they came out the door. However this would NEVER have happened had there been some due diligence as to being at the correct house to begin with.

Fortunately the domestic disturbance they were responding to was not life threatening to the caller as there was no response to their home across the street.

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I suppose I find the word “condemn” to be a pretty strong description of “accidentally knocked on the wrong door”

I have knocked on the wrong door before, more times than I can count in my life, I sure am glad nobody came out trying to shoot me for it, despite the fact that I couldn’t be murdered by the resident had I not been at the wrong address.

In full disclosure I know how easy it is to be at the wrong address, and how imperfect people are, or at least how imperfect I am. I used to deliver for UPS and, yes, knocking on the wrong door happens. I’ve also had people wrong on my door when it was the wrong one. It happens. You don’t get to try to murder people over it, that’s 100% on the homeowner. And these days that includes at night, Amazon delivers 24 hours a day around here now and you can order pizza etc very late. It happens.

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But your mistake did not cause loss of life of an innocent person either…
Just sayin’…

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Correct, my mindset did not cause me to try to murder someone for knocking on my door.

The mindset here that caused loss of life was the homeowner answering the door by rushing out and pointing his gun at the people out there.

100% the mindset that caused the homeowner’s death was the homeowner’s mindset and you are correct, I did not have that mindset when people knocked on my door

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I think this is a pretty serious thing to have the proper stance on.

People legitimately are afraid of their neighbors owning guns, of me owning a gun, of you owning a gun, of your children owning guns, because they legitimately fear that their kid or family member coming to visit them or looking for their dog or whatever will knock on the wrong door and be shot/killed over it. Because they fear the gun owning resident will do what this man did.

It is a completely unacceptable reaction and we need to be unified on understanding and spreading that message.

Fortunately, very few gun owners are…mistaken…enough to take these actions. Let’s keep it that way.

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Wrong address or not, innocents or not. You answer the door and point a gun at the police something bad is going to happen really quick.

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