And where is their proclamation asking customers not to come in wearing KISS makeup? What else might scare us fragile elderly folk, into a heart attack? Teen or twenty something males in a group? People with dreads? 50ish guys with long hair and motorcycle chaps, vest and a wallet chain? Guys with a flat top and tattoo sleeves? Anyone with a neck tattoo? No proclamation on dress code or group size or tattoos is being made. Just guns.
Not accepting the “save our sick customers” as a baseline for singling us out. This is about guns, not about feeble customers.
OC has a deterrent factor, which is especially important for those of us who look like someone’s grandmother… just the folks who your example says they might seek to placate or protect.
Disarming me for my own good… removing my deterrent effect may force me into a gunfight I wouldn’t otherwise have.
“No shoes, no shirt, no service” is usually a health code thing where food is served (although anyone could post it.)
2A supporters are tired of being punished due to the actions of disturbed individuals. Yes, we can write our opinions to the company. Yes, we can take our business elsewhere. I try to conceal even if using an owb holster, usually with an over shirt. I can and probably will change drug stores.
Not saying they violated my rights anywhere, but their choice still legitimizes the suppression of OC… look how quickly companies have followed on with the idea.
That legitimacy WILL be used as a platform to reduce things like concealed carry… that IS how loss of rights occurs.
And this is once again implementing a restriction that has NO impact on the real problem of crime, which actually makes us less safe, and marginalizes guns and gun owners. And THAT is the heart of anti-gunners effort to dismantle the second amendment.
Ahhh, but they’re not disarming you…just asking you to conceal it (unless you don’t have a CCW in a right to carry State and then I suppose they are).
I see the signs up in local store about removing Halloween masks around Halloween (although, you’re correct, never addressed KISS makeup) and the same thing in the winter asking folks to remove their ski masks…but good points regarding other attributes that may “scare” folks.
So while there was no “proclamation” I think many retailers do already have a practice around that.
I agree, it’s not about “feeble” customers, it’s definitely about my two points re signaling and positioning themselves prior to lawsuits.
When I OC, I do so for the deterrent effect… that is what they are removing. And that does disarm me… it reduces my ability to deploy all my legal resources and options.
We consider removing a person’s right to carry a gun to be disarming them, even though they are still allowed to carry a sharp stick.
One way I can actively defend myself - by displaying my teeth BEFORE someone selects me to be their victim - is being removed. That is a disarmament.
Fair enough…a study on that might be interesting, but unfortunately the data wouldn’t be accurate because we wouldn’t be able to determine how many criminals were actually deterred by it (since I’m sure they’re not answering survey’s later saying “whew, but for that lady carrying that 1911 cocked and locked, I was going to rob that place and pistol whip the hell out of those folks.” we would only be able to determine when it didn’t work.
Although I could see anti-gunners calling for just such a study in order to attempt to get more data points to their cause (but like so many of their data points it would be flawed).
@Zee I did talk to my wife last night about this. And she said that a memo was put out. But that she hasn’t seen it yet. And she also told me that if it is true that she’s fine with it. And that in her store they’ve had someone come in and was spinning a gun around their finger. It did turn out to be a toy gun. she also said that someone has also come in and fired shots off in the store as well. But no one got hurt from it. But I’ll keep everyone up to date on this once she tells me what it says.
Here’s a question for @MikeBKY and @Tom_Grieve. I’m a Walgreens employee. I work at a distribution center. If, the company adopts a no gun policy in the stores, and I am caught carrying in the store, can I face disciplinary action. I’m not talking about while I’m on the clock. I’m saying, off work, on my own time.
When I sent my email to Walmart I beat them to the punch noting Walgreens and Sam’s Club who’ll most likely announce next. They’re all under the same umbrella and all revenue roads lead to Rome.
I also pointed out won’t use/purchase any of their brand products or services. Auto Center, pharmacy, eye center, etc.
Well, just had my first encounter at Walmart with conceal carry. I bent over to fix my shoe lace and a Walmart associate was passing by and apparently saw “something “ that looked like the butt of a gun pressed against my shirt. She stopped and asked if I was carrying a gun? I asked why would you ask that? And she said that’s what it looked like when I was passing by. I said oh, ok. She then said so are you? I said I don’t have to tell you that and it’s none of your business. I may or may not be carrying. It could be my cell phone. She said that it was her business and needs to know ASAP. I said well I’m sorry for you then because your not going to get an answer. And legally I do not have to answer that question. She turned around and walked away angry calling for management. So I really hope that this doesn’t get out of hand now throughout Walmart’s and stores in general. It would be a bad thing for the employees now to think that they can “police” this themselves. They are only going to cause some serious problems. Pretty much why this whole ban thing is so stupid.
Unfortunately, I am neither an employment law attorney nor am I familiar with your contract or the laws in your state. It would seem that you have an argument for saying your contract ought no apply on your own time, but I really cannot say.
This is turning into a witch hunt. I believe enforcement of this policy is impossible. It may be corporate policy, but will managers in more rural areas enforce it? My answer is more than likely because they answer to a regional manager.
Thank you. If the situation were to arise, I would find out my legal standpoint, before I pushed the issue. In Illinois, violating the “sticker” gets me a misdemeanor and 150 dollar fine too.
Thank you. I felt like I handled it the correct way. I wasn’t trying to be rude to her but I guess I was already upset a bit about the ban going on. Now I was carrying at that moment but felt she had no right to ask me especially if I was following the “new” rules and had it completely concealed. I asked a few law enforcement friends about the encounter to see what their opinion was. Now I am a bail enforcement agent. I’m not a police officer but am part of law enforcement. So also asked them if I could carry openly being that I am a part of law enforcement. They are not sure about it but they are going to find out. What they did tell me is that she or anyone in management in any store does not have any right to ask if you are carrying concealed. It’s none of their business. And by them being alerted to it now and maybe saying something out loud to another employee or management can be misconstrued by other patrons causing a panic.
I agree. Most of them probably have no experience or knowledge on guns or laws in general. Only going by the stores new policy. They can’t use the defense of being ignorant or not knowing anything except what management has passed down. It’s not a defense, but have a feeling that’s what they will use as one. And I can totally see in the very near future, we will be hearing about an ugly incident because of this if it were to happen somewhat like it did with me.
One could also envision every unit in the Sams/Walmart/et al business group will need a mandatory annual employee training program to notify and inform, at the minimum, their public facing agents (if not entire retail operations divisions staff) how to understand, and apply/enforce this Corporate policy.