US CCA and the McCloskey’s and white pregnant woman question

The white pregnant woman I’ll put to the side button McCloskey’s in St. Louis brandish but they never fired a bullet. Are you covered with the USCCA if you brandish and don’t fire?


Legit question, would also be interested. Was a pretty nice weekend. Imagine someone will have an idea.

The folks in St. Louis definitely had the right idea BUT did y’all notice how both of them muzzled folks AND each other! The woman pointed the weapon at everyone and hubby had his AR pointed at her. Frankly not the image the 2A folks should want out there. She should have been at low ready and he at high ready or port. Training definitely in order. You should never knowing
Y violate Rule 2


So each state from my understanding has their own laws on Brandishing a firearm/ drawing/ intimidation. I think a draw is considered different state by state. We should all practice low ready. One other thing I know that having one in the chamber can change a case entirely state by state as well.

I carry with one in-chamber in the real world but, in a court case, (paper world) if the firearm was un-chambered, the jury would say (Victim) drew an unloaded firearm, warned, commanded attacker, then racked the slide, giving the offendor plenty of time to stop the life threatening actions. This could win a course case against you just by that small detail.

These people pretty much broke all the 4 universal laws of firearms.

  1. I’m sure the guns where loaded,
  2. They had fingers on triggers you can see from the video.
  3. They pointed at things they didn’t intend to destroy.
  4. They had crowds of people behind each other, a miss would hit someone for sure.

@Michael248, with all of the different laws in different states (as @Jiffer mentioned) and the huge variety of situations, there is no one concrete answer.

I have never heard of carrying one in the chamber ever being a good thing in a legal defense situation. Giving the offender/attacker plenty of time to stop the life threatening action very well could backfire and give them all the time they need to attack/kill you.

The USCCA trains to have one in the chamber when you carry. Just like you won’t be able to put on your seatbelt as a car accident is happening, you very well may not have time to rack a round into the chamber when you’re in a self-defense incident.

Use commands to attempt to stop the threat is one way to let the attacker know that you will defend yourself. “STOP! DROP YOUR WEAPON! I WILL DEFEND MYSELF!” And also shows witnesses that you are trying to avoid shooting.

The prosecuting attorney can very well twist everything we do to try and win their case. I suggest finding out how your local law enforcement carries and read/take as many classes as you can. Being able to articulate why you did what you did based on research from X, Y, Z locations can definitely help your legal defense.


So… this is a situation USCCA would not entertain a defense? I do understand the gun handling skills were non-existent. And, doubt there was any shooting time, ever.

@Michael248, Yes, I agree that one in the chamber is the best method. I do have another question Dawn can I PM you?

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You can PM me at any time, @Jiffer! If it’s the middle of the night when you PM don’t expect a response until the morning :wink:

That is really not my question but I fully understand what you’re saying and I carry with one of the chamber. But it sounds like US CCA would not even touch either situation since no bullet is fired am I correct? Which would be sad because there was a de-escalation that took place and no bullet fired.

well are you employed by USCCA? or just a community manager?

It all depends on the circumstances of the situation and the local laws, @Craig9. I cannot give a concrete answer as every situation and the laws in every state are different.

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I work for the USCCA, @Jiffer. :slight_smile:

@Michael248, you do not have to shoot for your USCCA Membership’s legal protect to be of assistance. Your membership will help when you’ve had to defend yourself with any legal weapon.

That being said, due to the huge variety in details and situations that come up in “what if” scenarios, I am not able to give a concrete answer.


Thanks, Dawn. That’s what I was asking. I do understand laws are different all over. Wanted to know if this was a self defense situation where USCCA would be able to give some assistance legally. I know they both need some training from USCCA. Thanks again

I got this video from AZ Defense League today. and it has Att. Andy Marcantel going over Arizona Laws for self defense of self and property. And he also talks about the Arizona laws and how they work. How they work. And he did mention the McCloskey’s and what they did. The video is around 23 minutes long but had good information on Arizona Defense Laws. Here it is for everyone to see.