I visited this church again this week to see how they’re doing and to look over another issue I’ve seen.
There is an upstairs area that has 5 classrooms all being accessed by 1 internal stairwell as well as a door to the outside that has steps down to the ground level. In the entire upstairs there is but 1 fire extinguisher and it is in the middle of the main hall. No FE at the exterior door, and worse, no FE in each classroom to battle your way out in the event of fire. 2 of the rooms have no windows either.
The main Services Hall has 2 exits to the entrance/vestibule, a door back to the youth gym, and 2 emergency doors. Of this whole area there is one FE by one of the back doors!
There is NO FE in the youth gym (walls are made of all OSB board)
There is a FE outside the door to the kitchen
There is 1 FE in the vestibule that has 4 entrance doors.
I can’t believe that an inspection by the Fire Department would ever pass this place! The worst problem would be if there were a fire on the first floor below the classrooms with day care and youth services in progress.
Whenever you go a restaurant, store, movie theater (funny, movie!!! maybe next year) or Church (for 60-90 minutes) look at the same issue and be sure to think about a safe means if egress.
I agree with you. I say the same thing. I have taught my kids at a young age about firearms and safety. They didn’t show much interest then, however as adults that all wanted to learn to use a firearm responsibly. I think that our military would benefit from the diverse personnel and we would have a quick response to any national threat. I believe this is why the US has not been attacked on our own soil with the exception of cowards who kill innocents.
Here in Michigan churches are actually no gun zones, even with a CPL, without the explicit permission of the church’s pastor. Which I would definitely get in writing.
@Larry81. am in the process of trying to develop a EOP at out church but the task seems a little overwhelming to me at the moment. Would it be possible to get a copy of the EOP that you developed that I can use as a template for one of my own?
Thanks in advance.
Greg,
Fizbin is the one who wrote the book and sent me a copy. I am in the process of trying to set up an EOP program as well at our church. If you have trouble emailing him I can look in my back email and try to find his number. Good luck to you
Larry
I’ve got basically a first draft that I can send you. It is an early stage that way you can fill in your blanks and adjust it to suite your particular need. @Aaron25 sent me a very very comprehensive Safety Service Manual for their church that covers EVERYTHING. Let me ask him if I can share it. PM me and I can get you mine.
Just want ed add to what you just said. My wife & I just left a church like the one your talking about. We really liked the church. But when it came to protecting the church, our family & children, it was like talking to a stone wall. And it’s like they don’t care. They took a Saturday morning to have a security team come in to the church and talk about church security. They were well informed, but didn’t think they really needed that.Not willing to do the right thing. And they know the danger but it’s like they don’t care. Its plain they value a few dollars more then the safety of the church and the lives of the members. So we left that church and not looking back. I was born to protect my family as well as others. And I will do that, whatever it takes.
Well, last week we decided to leave our church as well.
There were a lot of things in addition to the security thing.
In the end, they refused to get fire extinguishers, pay for the monitoring for the system I put in, or implement the EOP, I was asked to present to the elders 3 different times, the plan, which I did. They accepted the plan and implemented part of it.
The pastor invited me to lunch 4 times to show him how the system worked, I went each time. Each time I brought my laptop and all my security info and all he did was try to get me to get baptized and start coming to Thursday evening bible study. He NEVER talked about security at the Lunch Security meetings. I was invited to stay after service twice to show him how it worked.
Last week he wanted to get together again (#5) to show him, I had to tell him no, “I’ve spent too much time on this”
All in all I wasted time 9 different times, enough is enough.
Our state is good on most things but seams not to care on others issues at hand. Like guns in a church. In this state not supposed to carry a weapon in church. The only way you can carry one is the church has to post a sign saying weapons are welcome. Or you need to get a ok in writing from the leaders in the church. Good luck getting it done. They need pass the laws that permits CCW to carry in church as well as hospitals. And most of us already know that the sign on the door will not keep bad people from coming in with guns and doing a number on everyone.
No locking doors is not good, if the creeps want inn they will find away to do so. Best thing is for a church to set up real security and have police offices, ccw & military protect the church. And have USCCA to back the church & security team.
My state, (SC), allows church members to carry once the church leadership approves it and the approval is on file at the church. In my particular church, Elders are the body that approves/declines these requests, and we have yet to say no to any request. My church is an Associate Reformed Presbyterian, so it comes down to denomination and individual church in my state.
Our neighboring state NC, allows carrying in church, as long as you have a state issued CWP.
All I’m saying is if you have a security team in a church, you would use police offices, ccw & military to be on the team. the one’s that know s how to defend, that’s all I’m saying.