Instructor Notes: "Well that just makes me feel uncomfortable"

I lead our church Safety & Security Team and we designed our EOP after the USCCA “Countering The Massed Shooter Threat”. We developed a team, trained those willing and able to carry a firearm as well as trained in trauma first aid, hardened the facility and increased camera surveillance and communication capabilities. When it came to practicing our Lockdown and Evacuation procedures on a Saturday with pastoral staff, church staff and ministry leaders we were totally surprised as to the interest so we opened it up to congregation members. We had 3 times the amount expected and 5 other churches requested invites, which we accommodated. The training went well and was appreciated by all.
The point is do not be concerned that your church may be afraid because they are more afraid if you don’t have a plan.

4 Likes

Have you hired an accountant to advise you on investing your lottery winnings? Why not? It is the “if” vs “when” mindset. No one really expects to win the lottery so they don’t hire someone to advise them, until it happens. If you have people who have the “when” mindset, they buy snow shovels and additional groceries when the weatherman says winter storm coming. It can’t, won’t, will never, happen here or to me mentality is what allows the large body counts that the mass murders want. Those who expect and hope it never happens, cut the attack short in 8 seconds, like the West Freeway Church of Christ in White Settlement, TX.

1 Like

Think about this, most churches in America are local, and just scrap by financially. You, being an armed consultant invalidates their standard liability insurance. You training their member(s) for armed presence invalidates their liability insurance. If you or one of your trainees actually have to pull your guns in the line of “duty?” they are screwed without liability insurance. And to put your services under liability would crash most churches. It is better to just have members, on their own, to get training, and carry concealed. These people should have insurance themselves. You and your services are just not worth the bankruptcy that would follow an armed intervention!

2 Likes

Maybe, but just think of the lives that would be saved.

2 Likes

I do, and you obviously don’t. Bankrupting churches and other small businesses is not my deal. I am a State Certified (the state I live in) and a NRA certified instructor and my training is free and NOT to gun newbies. I believe in 2nd Amendment but, seriously, charging people for training? I started training DPS and various sheriff’s department as a side-line in the late 70’s. Haven’t been sued, haven’t run a scam on vulnerable companies.

1 Like

My wife & I were members at a local church. We really liked the church but it had a few big down falls. The security was next to none. Just felt unsafe because the leadership didn’t feel is was necessary to have security. And it was not like they were blind to this. A outside source came in and talked about church security and how dangerous it was not to have it in place. They know the danger but willing to have a security team. They think it will never happen in our church.

2 Likes

It’s one thing if someone has a ND at church, but out of curiosity, are there cases out there where someone has stopped a mass shooting and had to pay liability? (I’ll bet there are, I’m just curious.)

1 Like

thats the part that makes many organizations run away…liability!

Fizbin,
let me know if you’d like a copy of our SOP. We have police level quals, both medical and armed safety services teams at every service and event.
In my opinion, the congregants don’t need to be told anything–they’re not going to do anything right in the event of an emergency anyway. In the words of Jesus, they are sheep (I crack myself up). We got our SOP approved by church leadership, attorneys, and the insurance company to ensure appropriate approvals.
In OH, you can only carry in a church with permission, so only our safety services team is technically ‘allowed’ to carry. We have rubber wristbands that signify you can carry and logo’ed polo shirts. The one thing we haven’t figured out is what to do with off duty LEOs. My concern is that if there is an incident, the LEO will have a great chance of being mistaken for a bad guy and be shot by the team.

1 Like

I don’t know that I agree with you. Our churches effectively gone through the process of spelling out our strategy in an SOP and it was approved by the insurance company.

2 Likes

Hey Aaron,
Sure, I’d like to take a look at it and see if there are any holes I’ve missed.
I’m pretty sure you’re correct on congregants basically standing there with giant cow eyes, and mouths dropped open in the event of a DCI.

We can carry in churches so the plan WAS (untill they stood down on the whole thing) to identify the LTC folks and ask them NOT to engage the threat as there are a select few who have threat engagement training in crowds.

The best thing a congregant would do would be to drop flat on the ground, no popping heads up to peak.
You got my email, shoot it over to me. :slight_smile:
I can send you my EOP, but it’s pretty long and comprehensive.

1 Like

Haven’t been to a church service in years. I’m thinking security is a good idea. But locking the doors of a church. Is this a thing nowadays?

Oddly enough, Democratic Georgia Senate candidate Raphael Warnock mentioned armed parishioners attending church services. He further talked about houses of worship forming groups of gun-toting protectors attending services to keep fellow worshipers safe.

He and his audience got a big chuckle out of these safety measures.

Most likely an attempt to further prohibit guns from being used to thwart nefarious situations, and a way to get the unsuspecting to help in disarmament of the population.

I’m just saying.

I got nothing to say I just really liked that line

1 Like

I have been in a similar situation. I have had to convince the church leadership that its not if but when. they were ere ok with quiet response but when we discussed trained armed security team, they didn’t like it. I couldn’t get them to even try a fire drill during the service. every HOW wants a security plan but don’t seem to be interested in a proactive plan. those who fail to plan plan to fail. be armed and stay safe. the wolf is always at the door lurking

Sounds like the ole, “you can lead a horse to water but you can’t make him drink” applies here. You have done what you were hired to do and now it’s up to them. I never did understand why someone would pay for training and then disregard part, or all of it.

2 Likes

What’s interesting is there are 2 people who watch the cameras up in the booth but they don’t know who or have a procedure to tell anyone what they see.

The right to protect yourself, your family and the community is in the bible. I think you would find them in the old testament and right after Jesus acended to heaven. Check out Psalms 18 it is a worship song by King David. Tells the story of how God saved him from harm and helped in battles. if thats not fighting to preserve your people and worldview I dont know what is.

4 Likes

I am new to firearms so I am not a teacher, but I explain my wanting to learn self defense this way. I believe we have become like Israel, where every man and woman needs to know how to defend themselves because of terrorism against their worldview. I believe men and women at 18 do a 2-year term, so they can train every man and woman to defend. There is a lot of wisdom in that.

2 Likes

Amen to that!