I’ve been trying out various ammo brands/variations for a relatively new 10mm pistol (an 80% “G20” build). I’ve tried about a dozen different brands/loads, and still trying a few new ones since a few of them had some difficulty with the first round going into battery after inserting a mag and racking the slide. Aside from that, they’ve all cycled fine and I can shoot really well with this pistol.
Anyway, I picked up a few new ones to try at the range last night, including Magtech’s 180gr JHP and 180gr FMJ. Everything worked great with the JHP, but the FMJ did have a bit of the going into battery issue, but what was really weird (to me) was the extreme amount of muzzle flash. This was in a normal indoor range lighting situation, and the muzzle flash was way beyond anything I’ve ever seen in a handgun. I normally don’t even notice it but this startled me every time. I only ended up firing 6 rounds of this, and it happened every time.
Is this something to worry about? I probably won’t get this product again but would like to finish the box as long as it’s safe. I have not had this issue with any other ammo I’ve tried in this gun which I’d guess has been at least a dozen or so brands/loads. I went through about 15 rounds of the Magtech JHP and there was nothing remotely like this, as I said I normally don’t even notice muzzle flash from this or any of my other handguns. TIA.
Practice/Range ammo, or inexpensive ammo, often has a lot of flash. The low flash powders are apparently more expensive.
10mm is likely to have more flash than the major/duty calibers.
I wouldn’t use/trust ammo that failed to go into battery in any way. If you’ve used a bunch of others without issue, just stick to the others. If the recoil felt similar and it functioned okay round to round, I expect the ammo (Magtech) is safe to fire.
Not trying to say this is what is going on, but I’ll throw some ideas out.
Since you have shot Magtech 180 grain FMJ in the past without the noticable muzzle flash, and the Magtech 180 grain HP also did not produce noticable muzzle flash, it could be possible the suspect Magtech 180 grain JHP either has too much powder in that lot, or the wrong powder.
Too much powder could overpressure the chamber putting the pistol, and you, into potential danger.
The wrong, possibly slower burning powder, could produce lower recoil that could contribute to the next cartridge not going into battery.
Either way, if it was me, I would not use the suspect ammo. If you have a lot of it, then I would get with Magtech for their response.
Do you only have the one box of that ammo? If so, I’ll change my vote to Gary’s and say, just don’t shoot it. It’s one box, risk/reward if it’s giving you funky vibes or whatever just don’t bother with it
Just to clarify, this was my first time shooting either of the Magtech, but correct that I haven’t seen any noticeable muzzle flash with anything else I’ve tried.
Also, to clarify, I’ve only had the going into battery issue with the first round from a magazine. It always cycles properly on subsequent rounds. Also worth noting that I also tried S&B’s JHP last night, and while I had previously had this issue with their FMJ, I did not have it with their JHP (only referring to the battery issue, not the muzzle flash).
I don’t think I noticed anything different as far as recoil, but the muzzle flash was so distracting it’s hard to be sure.
I am thinking Gary and Nathan’s combined advice not to keep using it makes sense, since I did only buy the one box. I think I will still contact Magtech though out of curiosity. A possible powder issue with this particular lot seems to make sense. Thank you!
Notice the Magtech is on the higher end of power. Magtech specifically says their data is generated using a 5 inch barrel - which is what I have. So, we have yet another variable in that the G20 barrel is about 1/2" shorter.
Just for completeness, I use a 24 pound flat wire recoil spring in my 10mm. Maybe your recoil spring getting tired is part of the not going into battery issue.
Cool, thanks for the info. I’ll have to check the specs on my recoil spring. So far I’ve found enough ammo that doesn’t have that problem, so I’ll probably just stick to those rather than swap anything out, since it otherwise runs really well.
Just a thought. You might want to compare the suspected hot round spent casing and the normal round and see if the hot round is deforming / flattening in the primer pocket from excessive pressure.
Interesting. I did not hold on to any and probably wouldn’t have been certain which rounds they came from, since I was shooting 3 different brands/types.
What is 80% of it?
Is the slide catching on the frame anywhere?
As previously posted I would check the guide rod assembly.
My G20 never had an issue with any ammunition and my RI 1911 10mm shoots fire like a dragon and is loud enough to wake Biden up from a nap.
You should be concentrating on the first round from the muzzle being effective in stopping or severely diminishing the threat. Unless there are multiple immediate threats muzzle flash should not be your first concern. Land that first hit.
Yeah this was at a range, so the “threat” was just a paper target. I was not evaluating this for defensive ammo use. The concern is whether I was doing damage to my firearm. Perhaps I didn’t emphasize just how excessive this muzzle flash was. If I had to quantify, I’d say about 50-100x what I’ve ever seen with any ammo in any handgun, which generally I generally barely notice in a normally lit indoor range.
Thanks, although given the mixed opinions here, I’ll likely take the cautious route and not use the rest of this one box. I did contact Magtech and provided the lot number, so I’ll see what they have to say.
Lots of good “techy” answers provided. From a simple standpoint: In a perfect world all powder would be burnt during the time from when the primer is ignited until the projectile exits the muzzle. This almost never happens, because bore’s have different diameters, each caliber has its own group of acceptable powders, and - for the most part - the there is no great variance in barrel length. A round not going into battery is a whole different kettle of mackerel. Ammo manufacturers publish info on their burn rates and efficiencies, and can generally recommend loads that offer results more to your liking. Just remember - everything has a consequence. Selecting a quicker and cleaner burning round may have ballistic trade offs.
For training ammo you do not have to worry about flash. It is what it is. One ammo shoots with flash, another without…but it doesn’t change anything with training and practice procedures.
I don’t think that manufacturers care about their training ammo making flash…
I personally found it interesting and sometimes keep few boxes of ammo which creates strange or weird effects and use it during “low light” training.
One day I have ammo that made sparking effects after each shot.
Once I turned lights off it looked like fireworks.
However you shouldn’t use any self defense ammo that makes muzzle flash… unless you see advantage of having such flash coming out from the barrel.
I appreciate all the feedback, although I’m still not sure I’m conveying just how excessive the muzzle flash was. It was similar to what I find in photos if I do an image search, but those mainly seem to be captured with high-speed cameras, whereas what I was seeing was with the naked eye, so presumably it did not dissipate nearly as fast as usual. Anyway, Magtech did respond asking for a bit more info.
Also, I may have over-emphasized the going into battery issue. I really only mentioned it as the reason I’ve been trying different brands and versions of ammo. It’s a relatively minor issue - as I said, it only happens loading the first round from a magazine, and it takes just a nudge to get it the rest of the way forward. It never happens when cycling after fired shots, and I’ve found enough ammo that works just fine that I don’t feel the need to do anything to the gun itself.
The battery issue still wouldn’t happen and my gut reaction is to say “this is why I buy factory stock Glocks and leave them mechanically stock”…because non-stock Glocks (and/or reloads) are generally the way Glock pistols have issues.
It’s likely going to be tough for internet folks to diagnose a function issue with what sounds like an essentially homemade or at least home assembled/non-factory pistol
That said, we can try.
When you load the first round, are you locking the slide to the rear, inserting the magazine, and then using the slide stop to drop the slide, all without interfering with the slide’s forward motion?
Are you using factory stock Glock magazines that you purchased new?
What recoil spring are you using? What does the slide weigh?
@David1623 has a good point. Since the G20 has an unsupported chamber, do a search for Glock smile. Then look for it in the cases you have fired, if you have any of them.
