Police are famous for being poor gun handlers. Stories are out there of police officers shooting themselves or other re-holstering their pistols. Back when Glocks were first allowed here a few officers shot a racing stripe down their legs. And one shot himself when he thought a pistol was a lighter and it was a 25Cal Raven.
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Itâs never healthy to underestimate your opponent
Famous? No, There are just too many LEOs who sometimes get complacent.
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I donât, neither are criminals my âopponentsâ. However, getting a better understanding of those that seek to do harm is good. Understanding that most are stupid helps assess the possible threat. Stupid people can do amazingly stupid things that we just cannot imagine, so not being surprised by idiotic behavior will help you react to it. Being situationally aware will help, regardless of whether or not the criminal is a moron or is the rare one with some intelligence.
I will go with that.
The criminal mind is actually fascinating to study. There is an excellent article in the latest Conceal Carry magazine which you should take a look at.
While I agree with you that criminals can do very stupid things, painting any demographicâespecially criminalsâwith so broad a brush is something I fear done at your own peril.
As an example, it was recently the 30th anniversary of the Dana Ewell case, a tragedy with which I am well acquaintedâ
When discussing CC and criminals, we generally would be in public or someplace other than at home. The type of criminal one would encounter on the street is not an ivy-league graduate. I am getting this from a relative that is now a retired LEO. He was a patrol officer, plain clothes, and a detective. So, know the âdemographicâ. Again, situational awareness matters far more than the intelligence of the criminal.
How about a good guy with no sense?
Open carry is a 95 percent deterrent to criminals.
In 2015 a gas station attendant stopped my pump so I would come inside. I was open carrying and when i walked in the door the guy with the gun bolted out the other side. I had no idea that there was a guy with a gun in the store. Because of my somewhat professional attire, she thought I was a cop or security. The station was robbed 8 times that summer.
In most defensive situations the gun never leaves the holster. In those very rare instances that some criminal is going to try and take your gun, they usually have size, strength and the element of surprise.
I have open carried plenty of times and for those thinking that they are going to be a criminalâs first target, would you rather the first target be a child, a woman with a child, or someone weak that a criminal wonât be challenged by?
If you are terrified of being a prime target, then you cannot honestly say you carry to protect everyone around you. I am a 53 year old man with no kids and no family. Better someone like me be the first target the mother of some child or a young father. While I have plenty to live for, i would rather be the one a criminal tries first than someone weaker than I am.
I do carry to protect myself and anyone else near me. While some of the tactical clowns on here think they are somehow going to get a shot off as a surprise, i doubt it. Most people get scared and run. Having been shot it was not nearly as traumatizing as the kidney stone I had.
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I get where you are coming from, but, there is something to be said for the element of surprise, and for not being the first target. Itâs similar to a cop responding to a scene and putting their safety first, in that, if they are the only responder currently present, should they go down, there is nobody else.
You canât protect those around you if you were the one taken by surprise in the opening move.
So, there is a reasonable basis for preferring concealed and surprise.
There is also a reasonable basis for open and deterrence.
Some things just donât have black and white, this is better or that is better, period across the board done, answers.
This is one of them.
And, IMO, itâs as much about specific circumstance as it is about personal preference.
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Been carrying for years.Ive never shot anyone stateside.Matter of fact never had to draw on anyone.You tell me.You seem to have all the answers.
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Agreed. 100 percent. Circumstances are everything. I am a pretty big guy and when i carry concealed i print like a kid in kindergarten. Wide ruled paper and all.
That being said, I teach permit to carry and I read people when I am out and about and carrying. Situational awareness is never green. That being said I would rather be the guy someone goes after than letâs say the permit holder with babies at home.
I care about people and if by virtue of that I am the target of opportunity, so be it. I carry concealed and open about 50/50 depending on where I am. It also depends on the season and what I am wearing.
At any rate we agree on more than we donât brother so no harm no foul.
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Canât say that I have ever stopped a crime from being committed, but because I open carry often I have been able to meet and converse with a wide range of people of varying interests and backgrounds. Several of the people working in the Mini-Mart I frequent on my way to work in the AM now shoot regularly at the nearby range. Parents with younger children, noticing that I am not a LEO, often ask me to explain to their child why I carry and how it is safe to do so. Is there a risk of being singled out for violence? Sure. But random violence is just that: random. When I am carrying concealed I am in a higher state of awareness, and even more so when open carrying.
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Yes, that is a definite benefit. I do not OC, except at events where I am a rep of a rights organization, but I will discuss firearm ownership and shooting with others. That is how I got many people that were âon the fenceâ to become converts after I got them to the range. They discover shooting is fun and that âgun controlâ is ridiculous. I remember one, a woman, during her first session, commenting about how stupid mag limits are, complaining about how frequently she needed to reload the 10-round mags for the .22LR pistol she was using (which are standard capacity for that handgun).
This is a good article that was bring to my attention today. Even it was posted on NRA Women site, it applied to all of us.
Because this thread is about âA reason not to open carryâ, you can just skip first part " The Pros of Open Carry" and jump directly to " The Cons of Open Carry".
https://www.nrawomen.com/content/to-open-carry-or-not-to-open-carry/
The Pros of Open Carry
1. Itâs comfortable. Open carry has some major advantages going for it, and the first is that itâs comfortable. For most of us, an outside-the-waistband (OWB) holster is considerably easier to wear and more comfortable than an inside-the-waistband (IWB) that might dig into or poke our hip, irritate our skin or get covered in sweat on a hot day.
2. You can carry a bigger gun. Because youâre not worried about trying to hide your gun under your clothing, the size of the gun is almost irrelevant, limited only by what you like and whatâs comfortable. You wonât have to compromise between size and concealabilityâwhich is especially nice if you shoot full-size handguns well but struggle with subcompacts.
3. Itâs fast. Wearing a gun outside your clothing means less to fuss with when you go to draw. You have almost instant access to an open-carried gun, without having to sweep your clothing out of the way in order to get a solid grip and draw. This is advantageous in pretty much all self-defense situations, but it might be particularly important if youâre hunting and youâre carrying a handgun for protection from fast-charging out-of-nowhere animals.
4. It helps normalize gun ownership. This is a big one you might not have considered. The more the general, non-gun-owning public sees firearms on the hips of normal, everyday folks just going about their business and harming no one, the more ânormalâ gun ownership may seem to them. Demonstrating that the right to bear arms is a safe and common practice could make the public more comfortable around firearms.
5. Bad guys know youâre carrying. When Willie Nelson famously sang in âPancho and Leftyâ that Pancho, âWore his gun outside his pants, for all the honest world to feel,â he was summing up this point: When you open carry, everyone knows you have a gun. This is a pro as well as a con (more on that in a minute). On the pro side, thereâs a chance your gun could serve as a deterrent. Itâs quite possible that some neâer-do-well might see it and immediately give you a failing grade on their victim interview or decide to ply their shifty trade in a different location. This is a definite win for you and possibly everyone around you.
The Cons of Open Carry
1. Bad guys know youâre carrying. On the flipside, when everyone can plainly see that you have a gun, you lose any element-of-surprise advantage you might have had in a criminal encounter. To a certain kind of bad guy, it can make you a target in more ways than one: Many people consider an open-carried gun practically a âshoot me firstâ beacon. Some criminals might even take it as a challenge, because âŠ
2. It draws attention. If youâre the **gray man**type who just wants to blend into the background, open carrying might not be for you. While many people wonât notice, at the same time, many will. And sometimes âŠ
3. People freak out. Itâs not unheard of for nervous busy-bodies to call the police when they spot someone walking their dog while open carrying and report âsomeone with a gun!â These encounters generally end just fine, but it would still interrupt your day. Youâre bound to come across (whether you know it or not) people who are going to be very uncomfortable seeing a gun. Even if people donât freak out, you still have to remember âŠ
4. It might invite unwelcome conversations. Some people canât keep their opinions to themselves, and almost everyone has an opinion on open-carried firearms in public. Do you really want to get berated by a nosy Nellie in the produce aisle who thinks she knows better than you and who acts offended by the mere presence of a tool she doesnât like or understand? You have to accept that open carry might occasionally open you up to critique or confrontation because âŠ
5. Youâre making a clear statement. No matter your politics, most people are going to associate guns with a specific political party. Even if they donât, when you choose to open carry, you are making a statement that many people are going to take in a political way. This might be a pro for you, but if you donât want to deal with the political association or just like to keep your opinion to yourself, it can be a con.
Considerations if Youâre Going to Open Carry
1. Where Do You Live? I live in the Deep South in a small town. Gun ownership is extremely common, and I usually spot at least one open carrier on every trip to the grocery store. Although I donât open carry myself, I wouldnât be nervous to do so, because most of the cons listed above are much less of a big deal in my locale. If I were to open carry in a major city, Iâd expect a better chance of an unwelcome conversation or someone freaking out. The culture and general attitude of your locale will make a big difference in how open carrying will be received and how much the above-listed cons will apply.
2. You Need a Good Holster. You always need a good holster when youâre carrying a firearm, open or concealed. I define âgoodâ as a holster that stays put, covers the trigger and retains the gun securely. Iâm not saying a bad guy is going to come up behind you and snatch your gun out of its holster and rob you with it (without data, I suspect that mostly only happens in the movies), but I am saying that retention is always important for keeping your gun secure and under your control.
3. Be Nice! When you let the world know youâre carrying a firearm, youâve automatically made yourself an ambassador for the Second Amendment, whether you want to be or not. Make sure youâre a good one by not acting like a jerk. You donât need to change your behavior or go out of your way to do anything differentâjust being a good human being is enough to help firearms ownership maintain a good image.
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Dykes reportedly chased Orr outside and a struggle ensued before the teen shot and killed Dykes.
Not exactly a smart move by the decedent. It wasnât the stealing of the firearm - again not properly secured - that killed him.
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