I began by saying this is a basic truth about HUMAN BEINGS. I said that I learned firsthand our “enemies” aren’t mostly evil people, but people who do/did horrid things because someone told them to and/or paid them to. I then said cops and soldiers are not exempt from this predominant behavior pattern of the human race. I am not interested in excusing hypothetical “classes” of people’s motives. I don’t know my next door neighbor’s motives. He’s a state trooper and an infantry combat veteran. Nice enough fella. But I would not DARE to presume I know what makes him tick.
In a moment of unprotected honesty here I agree with you. A goodly number of people on my friends list are Leo’s, ex Leo’s, military, ex military and other first Responders. They often confirm your assessment of human nature.
Many of them have expressed a concern that far too many today don’t embrace their carriers the same way as they did when they started. And unfortunately it seems as if that attitude is affecting the public’s support of them.
It is a matter of assigned blame. For the longest time there was unlimited support for all first responders by traditional Americans. However after Portland, Seattle, Tacoma and Chicago riots and watching people stand down from groups dedicated to destroying our traditions that changed.
The next cut to support for the same people was watching the response to the same kind of demonstrations in Washington DC. What was the difference between the groups? The riots all summer long and even today are by anti police and military groups. The one with the break in at the capital was by people that had supported police and military for years.
It seems the double standard speaks to what you are saying. The good people are being over looked and told to stand down. The bad are being used as a bludgeon against the people. And that creates new enemies.
@Robert5 I have been a soldier, a sailor, and a cop. My wife is a retired soldier and federal LEO. I have 2 brothers and a nephew who are retired soldiers. Obviously, most of our friends have LE and military resumes. But the topics we discuss here demand brutal and courageous honesty.
I have a retired Leo friend living in Arizona that has said the same thing. His contention is that a lot of people are willing to vent, even Leo’s, but that is all they will do. The real question is how many are prepared to live up to their words or commitment? The men and women that have resigned from PDs that get defunded are a good example. The Korean shop keepers that defended their businesses comes to mind as well.
The hard part is doing what is right and doing any thing you are told to keep a job. This in my opinion is harder for Leo’s and Military. They are caught between their oath and a chain of command. IMHO
They are caught between their conscience, their oath, their chain of command, and the peer pressure. When your survival depends more on a wholehearted response to cover your six from your coworkers, other professionals from neighboring/overlapping jurisdictions, and so forth than it does your own skills and smarts; the stakes of peer pressure could not be higher. If they love you, they will disobey orders and break oaths to save you. If they don’t consider you “one of us,” they will ignore your dying screams over the radio. Facts. You have to be willing to die for what you believe is right, or you have no business doing these jobs. That’s a rare sort of courage. If only those who had it did those jobs, we would all be speaking German or Japanese. You have to build organizations capable of sustaining a culture whereby the peer pressure is a positive and civilizing influence without becoming effeminate. Sorry to say it, but we lost the ability to do this about 10-15 years ago.
I believe the question is whether they (the individual police officer) will take the time to consider if the order that is given is unconstitutional or Not! I am old enough to remember the MIe Lie Massacre and LT CALLY in Vietnam not sure of the spelling. There was a big argument as to who was responsible and who was not some soldiers followed order blindly and others refused. In the end I think the LIeutenant was the only one that went to jail.
But the point that @Sheepdog556 might as well be making is we may be losing our faith in our first responders . Still most people simply grumble and complain. People of character plan some action for when that day comes.
And example, in 1972 the US signed onto the World Heritage act with the UN. That act gave, at least, advisory authority to the UN over many of our Parks and historical sites. " In theory I suppose the UN could send troops to monitor those Heritage places, Including Independence Hall, to help protect them. There has been some debate on that. My feeling has always been that were that to take place without a vote by the people then the people would be justified to resist such an action by any force necessary. Seeing as they wear blue helmets knowing who they are should be easy.
If that were to take place there are some that would complain but do nothing because they figured if the government allowed it it must be OK. There are some that would fight it up to and including force of arms. Considering it a foreign invasion. I find it hard to believe I could vote to convict anyone for using force to resist such an action. I also wouldn’t support anyone that would support such an action, Police or military on stand down. It hasn’t happened and I don’t know if it ever would. But it is one more example of apathy versus duty.
It seems as if we are being tested to see how much we will take. Will we allow Portland, Seattle, Tacoma, Denver, Chicago and San Francisco to be lost to Anarchy? Or will we take sides and try to stop it? I think someone will have to take a stand sooner or later. But that is subject to opinion.