In 5 years there will be a commercial on TV for a law firm asking if you received this vaccine and how you could be compensated.
6 Likes
Actually, the vaccine companies are immune from lawsuits. If the vaccine is fully approved, then maybe, but only for those that get the poke after that date.
5 Likes
No. We were told, as distribution for retail goods/pharmacy goods, we were essential. We were told to make sure we had our employee I.D. in our vehicles at all times, in case of a âlock down.â My comment about hazard pay is a bit tongue in cheek. A year ago, we were essential, now, we are second class citizens. Where I work has not mandated vaccination, yet.
2 Likes
If we havenât done it with fake food, soda, red meat, and so many other things. This would be an outlier that they lawyers would have a field day with.
1 Like
Brother, why are you entitled to stuff like that? My small business crashed and burned during the pandemic. Iâm not bitching about the lack of a bailout (didnât qualify for a PPP loanâtoo new). â â â â happensâyou move on and try again.
MasksâSurgeons wear masks all the time to protect their patientsâit does the doctor no goodâitâs for the patient, but you donât hear them whining about it. And if it doesnât prevent infectionâwhy do they wear them??? You think itâs a whim that preventing the spread of infection involves wearing a mask??? There is a lot of crap science out there that tries to justify things. Iâm really tired of it.
Essential workers got paid to work. Thatâs their job. DId you really want to stay home/go on unemployment/not get paid? I doubt it.
Itâs not a surchage for not getting vaxxedâitâs mitigating risk. The insurance company and the health care systems want to lower the hospitalizations and deaths for more than altruistic reasons, granted, but they are right on this. Does life insurance cover soldiers or skydiving? Nope. People are making choices that increase their risk of death, so theyâre not covered.
By not getting vaccinated, people increase their risk for hospitalization/death. And when enough of them get sick, their group insurance rates go up, if theyâre insured through work. Why should others have to pay for their choices?
Just take responsibility for your decisions. Thatâs all Iâm saying.
1 Like
Hmmâmy old employer makes you pay more for your health and life insurance if youâre fat or if you smoke.
Makes sense to me.
100% false. I work from home. Who am I being exposed to, but my wife, who also works from home? Where is the increased risk?
Also 100% false.
Does Life Insurance Cover Skydiving Accidents? - 2020 (insurancelibrary.com)
When you apply for a life insurance policy most all ask about skydiving. If the answer is yes, it will depend on your experience level as a skydiver. There may or may not be extra premium involved, a rider excluding skydiving or a decline.
If a year later, on a whim, you jumped out of a plane and it didnât go well, they pay, as long as you didnât have a record of prepaying for the jump that is around the application time. {If} during the contestability period so the insurance carrier will investigate. What they are looking for is anything that ties you to skydiving that was prior to the date of the application.
Insuring A Soldier: Life Insurance For Military Members - Military Guide (the-military-guide.com)
All active, reserve and veteran military members have exclusive access to at least one type of life insurance, and most policies are tailored to specific branches of the military to allow the policies to cover activities commonly associated with the agency.
Of course. Unfortunately, if your company or the government is mandating the âvaccineâ, you only have two choices, and one can financially impact you and your family, short-term, the other could have a more long-term health effect, as there are no long-term studies on the âvaccineâ. However, there are studies on the spike protein that do suggest serious issues, short- and long-term.
Recent news has stated that the âvaccineâ, the spike protein, does travel outside of the injection area. These studies cover some of the known effects of that protein on the human body.
https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/CIRCRESAHA.121.318902
Paradoxically, ACE2 is protective in the cardiovascular system, and SARS-CoV-1 S protein promotes lung injury by decreasing the level of ACE2 in the infected lungs. In the current study, we show that S protein alone can damage vascular endothelial cells (ECs) by downregulating ACE2 and consequently inhibiting mitochondrial function.
We administered a pseudovirus expressing S protein (Pseu-Spike) to Syrian hamsters intratracheally. Lung damage was apparent in animals receiving Pseu-Spike, revealed by thickening of the alveolar septa and increased infiltration of mononuclear cells.
We next studied the impact of S protein on mitochondrial function. Confocal images of ECs treated with S1 protein revealed increased mitochondrial fragmentation, indicating altered mitochondrial dynamics.
Although the use of a noninfectious pseudovirus is a limitation to this study, our data reveals that S protein alone can damage endothelium, manifested by impaired mitochondrial function and eNOS activity but increased glycolysis.
This related article provides information related to the AHA study but in a less technical language:
In the new study, the researchers created a âpseudovirusâ that was surrounded by SARS-CoV-2 classic crown of spike proteins, but did not contain any actual virus. Exposure to this pseudovirus resulted in damage to the lungs and arteries of an animal modelâproving that the spike protein alone was enough to cause disease. Tissue samples showed inflammation in endothelial cells lining the pulmonary artery walls.
Previous studies have shown a similar effect when cells were exposed to the SARS-CoV-2 virus, but this is the first study to show that the damage occurs when cells are exposed to the spike protein on its own.
The researchers next hope to take a closer look at the mechanism by which the disrupted ACE2 protein damages mitochondria and causes them to change shape.
Concerning major adverse effects in patients receiving vaccination against SARS-CoV-2, local effects predominate, and severe systemic reactions are rarely described (Yuan et al., 2020). However, recent reports of an increased risk of blood clots, particularly of cerebral venous sinus thrombosis in the case of the Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine (Mahase 2021), raised a matter of debate on the safety of COVID-19 vaccine in general. Comprehensive analysis of autopsy data must be performed to provide more detailed insights into lethal adverse effects and any deaths associated with vaccination.
Kuba et al. showed that the injection of mice with recombinant SARS-CoV-1 spike protein reduced the ACE2 expression and worsened the acid-induced lung injury. In mice with an acid-induced lung injury, the recombinant SARS-CoV-1 spike protein dramatically increased angiotensin II, and the angiotensin receptor inhibitor losartan attenuated the spike protein-induced enhancement of lung injury. Thus, these in vivo studies demonstrated that the spike protein of SARS-CoV-1 (without the rest of the virus)1 reduces the ACE2 expression, increases the level of angiotensin II, and exacerbates the lung injury.
Our laboratory only tested the effects of the SARS-CoV-2 spike protein in lung vascular cells and those implicated in the development of PAH. However, this protein may also affect the cells of systemic and coronary vasculatures, eliciting other cardiovascular diseases such as coronary artery disease, systemic hypertension, and stroke. In addition to cardiovascular cells, other cells that express ACE2 have the potential to be affected by the SARS-CoV-2 spike protein, which may cause adverse pathological events. Thus, it is important to consider the possibility that the SARS-CoV-2 spike protein produced by the new COVID-19 vaccines triggers cell signaling events that promote PAH, other cardiovascular complications, and/or complications in other tissues/organs in certain individuals.
1 The spike protein of SARS-CoV-1 (without the rest of the virus) is what the âvaccineâ is.
Dr. Daniel Stock Schools the Mt. Vernon Community School Board on Science (bitchute.com)
I have also read about taking Vitamin D to mitigate effects of COVID-19, though it does much more than just that. There are reports from some of the major health clinics that support its use against COVID-19, also.
4 Likes
Before I make my statement. I am not a doctor (though I donât trust those anymore), I am not a virologist, I have a hard time finding the truth with all of the politics and censorship going on related to Covid. I donât Know what Iâm talking about, and your medical choices shouldnât be based on what I say at all.
Yep theyâre forcing people who have already had Covid to get Covid. Hospitals have required the flu shot for employees, I donât like that much BUT the flu shot has been around since 1930, so there might be a reasonable argument for requiring it. Covid vaccine has been around for less than a year. Itâs being pushed on people whoâve already had Covid. There have been clear complications for younger people. Theyâre already pushing boosters.
The vaccine should have been highly encouraged for the older population, the younger population should just be given the choice. The vaccine should not be forced on children who are more likely to die from the flu, homicide or a car accident.
Another interesting article I came across was an article talking about how a âleaky virusâ (which sounds like the current vaccine since they said you can be vaccinated and still pass it around) can lead to faster mutations. Wouldnât it be ironic if all the new strains were a result of the vaccine? It turns into a perpetual problem.
Covid has been handled so poorly in this country by all government entities (except Florida). I can no longer trust the CDC of public health officials because they continue to change their stances on things without supporting their decisions with data or research. They have made it impossible to know whatâs true and whatâs not. If the vaccines work, than anyone who wants it should get it and they will be safe. If someone doesnât want it, they shouldnât be forced to get it. I am 26 and healthy. My chances of being seriously ill over Covid is very unlikely assuming I havenât already had it.
6 Likes
Also, in the general population, the percentage of people that get it are still less than 100 in 100,000. So it is still not a concern of mine. Vacationed in Florida at the beginning of the year. Was amazing to see full bars and restaurants and no masks - and lived to tell about it. The silliness of air travel was not lost on me, either. In the airport terminals, you could not sit next to one another, but the flights were packed.
3 Likes
no kidding 
And we used to say US is the greatest nationâŠ
Covid is handled the same way as every new, unknown problem. And of course 50% of people will agree and other 50% will be against⊠thatâs the nature of humanity.
There is nothing to complain about CDC or our public health⊠look at the Europe, they have even worse, check Israel - few months ago they almost fought Covid off, having daily new cases close to zero⊠and now they are âback on trackâ⊠every single person of the World is struggling with Covid, so letâs stop accusing everybody and everything around⊠
Welcome @Robert1200
5 Likes
Well, I wouldnât mind holding the origin of the virus accountable, but thatâs a whole other story. 
I guess if you develop and release a virus (intentional or unintentionally), tries to cover it up, and it kills millions of people thatâs acceptable to the world?
6 Likes
Right now, there is no proof that this vaccine is preventing illnesses, or death. The masks that surgeons use are high quality, custom fit to user, and being used in a sterile environment. No the ones from Ace Hardware, not the ones from Walmart that say right on the box âdoes not stop virusesâ, and they certainly arenât the homemade masks that 95% of folks are wearing. Those 3 facts negate any argument about how effective masks are. One of my fully vaccinated coworkers, is in the hospital right now, with Covid.
Maybe we should charge a surcharge for cleanliness? Proper hygiene is the most effective means to fight a virus.
5 Likes
Since the unemployed, weâre getting 600 dollars a week, plus their unemployment, while the âessential workersâ got squat, yes, I would have sat at home and collected the money.
So, if Iâm subject to a penalty for âendangering life(Bull 
), then Iâm entitled for back pay at a hazard pay rate. If it is a danger to others for me to not get a vaccine, then it was a danger for me to go to work. Or, itâs not as dangerous as those who live a life of fear are implying. (99.95 survivable)
4 Likes
@Dave17⊠First off, thank you for the time and effort put into finding those references.
Just my opinionâŠ
From reading through most of your spike protein quoted references, it seems like:
- The spikeâs structure on the virus is different than the vaccinesâ spike structure
- The spikeâs structure on the virus has destructive qualities on cells from binding. The spike structures on the vaccines are specifically designed to disallow binding
I found the postmortem study interesting. Be aware that there are problems described that may not have anything to do with the virus nor the vaccine⊠sometimes stated outright, i.e. âthe old infarction areaâ in the brain. The study concluded that the vaccinated patient showed signs of immungenicity, but not complete immunity (meaning he had enhanced ability to fight the virus). The study also adds to my belief that protective measures need to be increased when visiting others in the hospital.
This is my understanding from the quoted references you listed, although I do agree that ongoing statistical analysis is necessary for a better picture of the potential side effects of the vaccines. It seems to me that we are in a long-term triage type event, where rushing to reduce fatality from a more known issue might mean rushing to a treatment with lesser fatality but with unknown potential side effects⊠for the record, I have received my vaccination, as well as my extended family members, some of which are in healthcare, and some of which had contracted the virus, recovered, and got vaccinated when it became available.
2 Likes
From, an article on Moderna back in 2016, long before COVID. Prophetic? Planned? You pick.
âFrom the start, Moderna heralded its ability to produce proteins within cells, which could open up a world of therapeutic targets unreachable by conventional drugs. The most revolutionary treatments, which could challenge the multibillion-dollar market for protein therapy, would involve repeated doses of mRNA over many years, so a patientâs body continued to produce proteins to keep disease at bay. Delivery â actually getting RNA into cells â has long bedeviled the whole field. On their own, RNA molecules have a hard time reaching their targets. They work better if theyâre wrapped up in a delivery mechanism, such as nanoparticles made of lipids. But those nanoparticles can lead to dangerous side effects, especially if a patient has to take repeated doses over months or years.â
3 Likes
Iâm not dismissing your insinuation of questionable funding and financial management of these companies. However, I get confused with some peopleâs references that list modern medical research that has been going on for decades, as well as general processes that have been attempted over similar periods.
The article you linked is basically gene therapy, and the problems encountered getting it to stay established within a complex organism (like human beings). For example, some chronic conditions, like mine, are the result of mutated DNA which do not encode the proper proteins for one or more of the bodyâs functions.
The drug companies have offered different options, such as from blood donors, mice/rats, pigs, cows, sharks, synthetics, etc. The protein for my medication currently comes from genetically engineered mice, IIRC. Gene therapy, at least when I was involved with it decades ago, tried to correct the genetic abnormality within the bodyâs cells, so that the body would have relatively normal production (basically like a menu at a restaurant with a mistype of âesrkjfgkerwgbâ for âhamburger,â and the chef not making a hamburger when the order came in).
At the time, this type of treatment could be considered a âcureâ which would not require indefinite daily, weekly, monthly, etc. regimens over time. This, theoretically, could have been a disaster to drug companies that created medications that needed to be continaully produced and consumed by the public. IIRC, a few years back small waves were made with the Hepatitis vaccine that had good results from only a two dose treatment.
The article you are quoting talks about getting the mRNA into the cells that are producing faulty mRNA. Transporting such sequences into a cell through the body is complicated, and the lipid or nanoparticle vehicle is just a way of getting the mRNA sequence to the proper location without it getting destroyed. It also seems like this is a compromise between correcting the DNA abnormality (potentially curing a disease) and treatments requiring ongoing medication.
Hereâs a link if anyoneâs interested that gives a relatively simple explanation of gene and RNA therapies: https://hsci.harvard.edu/translation/what-are-drugs-4-gene-therapies
Edit: I also wanted to mention that R&D is a cut-throat business. Even at the academic level, researchers constantly complain about co-workers stealing their research, releasing their findings in publications that were meant only as a preliminary âheads upâ in meetings, and even stealing hard drives off of computers for thesis/experimentation/etc data.
R&D in general is often an area where 999 out of 1000 attempts are failures. In an industry where you are trying to invent something that never existed before, or fix something thatâs never been fixed before, $$$$$$ investors donât want to hear about that, and paychecks, employment, etc. are riding on continual progress, something that is NOT gauranteed in the research sector⊠not to mention the âyou canât run a business based on products that lose moneyâ problem.
1 Like
@Scotty, I mostly agree with your conclusions. I am glad you took the time to become informed. @Kevin1776, I have read about the dangers of the nanoparticles, too, and I agree, the studies of them are quite worrisome.
2 Likes
I apologize. I wasnât clear in my response.
MOST INSURANCE COMPANIES (like the ones we all use) donât cover soldiering, skydiving, etc.âbecause their increased risk would transfer cost to the insured population.
The point I was trying to make without being â100% falseâ was that if a person or persons by choice, engages in high risk behavior, there should be consequences for it.
Iâd like the community to be a place that feels more like a group of friends, not a verbal fight.
Iâm out.
1 Like
Long story short, the social justice asshats I work for just mandated the Not-A-Vaccine shot for everyone in our office building ( not required for the people that that work in our retail outlets).
We are a national business with about 8 division offices that this idiotic requirement applies to.
The good news is I will be able to work from a secondary location and I literally will NOT be able to enter the other building again.
I work for morons.
1 Like