New sights differeent grouping

I I did a quick search and didn’t see any suggestions. I tend to use a combat hold when target shooting and depending on where my groupings are I can assess my bad habits pretty quickly. With three of my guns but one has me stumped. My 22 Mag revolver, .380 and 9 mm will punch paper prettu close to the center and maybe just a touch down and to the left. once I see that pattern I realize my pull it not a squeeze straight back but more of a pull that moves left. Take a breath, concentrate, and pull smoothly straight back and I am back on center.

My 45 has upgraded night sights on it and if you see the ten ring like the face of a wall clock when I am printing a close grouping they are in the ten ring just above the 5 O’Clock position.

What have I changed since getting these new sights? Well I have started looking harder at the front sight but other than that it is about the same. Someone mentioned that by changing my focus to the front blade I might be letting my dominate eye change my reap point of aim.

Since I came home from the range last time I have sat at home and practiced using both eyes on the sights. I sit watching TV with a Airsoft P226 sitting by my side. During a commercial I will focus on a target with both eyes open and try to get a clear target picture. And yes I do notice sometimes I almost close my left eye before I realize I am not using both eyes.

My question might be should I assume the front sight being taller needs to have the front dot higher compared to the back two? Or does anyone think it is a dominate eye problem? Maybe I am over thinking it and just need more practice with the new gun.

2 Likes

It could be a number of things, @Robert5. One eye vs two eye sighting will make a pretty big difference. Squeezing the trigger, finger placement on the trigger, new sights - all will play into being slightly off target.

A couple of suggestions that might help you figure out what’s going on:

  • Work with an instructor
  • Have someone record you while you shoot (multiple angles might help)
  • Remove the variables and possibly adjust the sights - shoot with one eye and the same grip consistently and base your sights on that setup
3 Likes

First question, is this a 1911 by chance?

Second question: what is the distance you are talking about here?

If your grouping is good, and consistent, perhaps you need to adjust the sights. It happens. Keep in mind though with the .45acp, the sights are regulated for a certain load. The 185gr load will not print in the same place as a 230gr one. Those big ol’ flying ashtrays every time! LOL Used to be that 1911’s were sighted in for 230gr ball at 850fps. Somewhere a lot of the switched to the 185gr loads.

I would center it first, using the rear sight. If you want to bring it up, either find another load, or get a shorter front sight. You could shoot it a lot and just learn where it shoots.

1 Like

@Dawn @MarkinMT

Both suggestions worth considering. I juts joined a gun club and may have to consult a instructor. I may have developed bad habits I cannot see.

It is a S&W M&P .45. I don’t shoot 230 gr Ball normally I prefer 185 gr SJHP. But when spending the day at the range 200 rounds of ball is a lot cheaper. I considered the ammo as well. . A Friend has turned me on to some 185 gr ball to see if that works better. The distance was at 10 yards.

Dawn I will try to see if I can remember to keep both eyes open for a whole range session and see if that makes a difference. One of the people at the range didn’t seem all that concerned at the grouping, he said take one of the targets home and tape it to a Polo shirt. Everything looks a lot more reasonable against a silhouette.

It has been a long time since I have been in a shooting class but as they saw you are never too old.

4 Likes

That makes sense - as long as the grouping is around where you’re aiming and not seriously off center.

When you’re shooting in a critical dynamic incident, the shots could be as spread out as much as your hand spreads out and still be considered accurate if the placement is right. Anything in the white box on the target below is considered defensively accurate:


(Not my target)

2 Likes

My Target would have covered a similar pattern. The biggest difference is there would have been except for the four or five flyers top and bottom all of my rounds were in the center and lower right quadrant. I will save a target next time. Photo share function on this sight or do I need a storage site?

1 Like

I don’t have the M&P 45, but I do have a M2.0 40. Although I haven’t that issue on the 40, I did notice a drop of POA on some of my lighter weight 9mm’s. For a couple of them, making sure I placed the pad of my finger on the trigger instead of too close to the joint fixed the problem for me. It was more apparent for me with the 124gr +p rounds vs 115 gr standard pressure.

1 Like

The other thing I’d try is putting a piece of transparent tape over your non dominant eye (on the glasses/safety glasses) and continue to work on both eyes open. You’ll still be able to ‘see’ out of it, but it won’t allow you to help out with the sights. I think this helps train you to get a better sight picture with both eyes open.

3 Likes

@Aaron25 This is an EXCELLENT suggestion. “Frosting” your non-dominant eye is a great way to teach yourself to shoot both eyes open especially if you are “Goofy Eye’d” like a lot of us. I shot the Camp Perry National Matches in 1991 and 1994 with scotch tape or a piece of milk jug taped over the left side of my shooting glasses to good effect (Medals, Rifles, etc) I am left eye dominant and right handed. In pistol I just turn my head to get my left eye to line up, on rifle I needed the frosting to turn off the left eye or at least “dumb it down” and let my right eye do it’s thing.

@Robert5 do not be alarmed that your various pistols will not have the same POA/POI (Point Of Aim / Point Of Impact) the ballistics of your given round will have a drastic affect on your POI. If you shoot “Combat” sight picture and your rounds are low move the target back. If they are high bring it forward. Pistols are not “Regulated” like the double and triple bore rifles of yore to be “ON” at a specific distance. They shoot where they shoot and as the driver of the gun you have the option to change the sights to fit not only your shooting style but the ammo that you carry.

That said if you are shooting combat zero @ 7 - 15 yards and you are SURE you are not yanking the trigger and you are hitting 2 FEET low you need to think about new sights or a warranty trip to the shop.

Cheers,

Craig6

2 Likes

@Craig6–I’m the same way–L eye dominant and R handed. I shoot rifle/shotgun/bow LH (most of the time) but pistol RH. So you shot Nationals with your non dominant eye? Impressive!

1 Like

@Aaron25 Not really that impressive. Both my eyes were 20/10 but my right eye has a +0.25 cylinder correction making my left dominant. By the end of the matches (East Coast Navy, All Navy, Inter-Service and the Nationals) I didn’t even have to “blur out” my left eye as the right eye had taken over. That lasted for about 2 months of not shooting rifle before it shifted back. Now I’m still 20/10 L and 20/15 R but blind as a bat inside 3’. This getting older stuff ain’t for sissies.

Cheers,

Craig6

1 Like

Count your blessings–I’m barely correctable to 20/20 in my L eye.

1 Like

@Craig6
Good advice. I will give it a try if I lapse back into closing my left eye. It was the first time I had shot 230 gr ball so I didn’t know what to expect. But I can assure you if I had been 2 feet low I would already have been to the gun smith.

Looks like once the weather clears about the only sports we can participate in that will keep us at least 6 feet apart in a well ventilated area will be at the range. It is a bit overcast here right now once it clears up I will give the suggestions a good look.

1 Like