My new 9mm EDC pistol

My new Sig Sauer p365 3.1" barrel and (3) 12 round magazines TACPAC. $475. It is wearing the Wilson Combat WCP365 tan grips with the weight rod package option for better balance and recoil suppression. I carry it in a pocket holster with no issues and I am waiting on my Odessa 9 suppressor to clear. I will carry the pistol with the suppressor in my Craft Roto shoulder holster. It carries vertical but swings to horizontal when drawing. I will order the True precision threaded barrel when I’ve saved up enough $$$. I shoot the 147 grn JHP subsonic ammo at 980fps. It is a great lil pistol for EDC.

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Sorry, I’m new and did not know how to see if my post took. So, the second post. My carry options for this p365 are the shoulder holster for suppressed carry, pocket holster for EDC no belt just suspenders, belly band for light clothing (little support for weight such as gym shorts/pants and the Alien tuck 3.5 for IWB EDC carry when wearing a belt.
I only carry concealed. Thank you to all you open carry folks. You make great decoys. However, you do contribute wonderfully when the perp fears that he’s gonna get hurt and moves on to easier pickings. Thanks for your bravery!!!

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Have you ever tried drawing a gun with a suppressor? Good luck.

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So, what was your decision process for selecting 147 grain subsonic vs. the Sig 365 115 grain subsonic designed specifically for 3.1 inch barrels? Is the 980 fps tested from a 3.1 inch barrel?

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Energy!
If you top out at the speed of sound, the only way to gain more energy is to use a heavier bullet.

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Speed of sound is 1125 fps. Therefore, both examples are less than speed of sound as shown below.

The 147 grain @ 980 fps is 313 ft-lbs muzzle energy. If it loses 50 fps thru a 3.1 inch barrel, then muzzle energy drops to 282 ft-lbs. If it loses more than that, then you already know the exponential reduction in energy …

The Sig 365 ammo is tested and designed specifically for a 3.1 inch barrel. At 115 grains and advertised average 1050 fps, it has 281 ft-lbs muzzle energy.

Edit: my calculations are slightly different from Sig. They print 282 ft-lbs vs. my 281 ft-lbs on the box:

image

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I would select the 147 because bigger is better.

In all seriousness, What would be the advantage of the 115 grain subsonic?

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More dependable expansion.

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I am, most likely, not the best guy to answer that question technically. However, I am after mass in the bullet I would be sending down range. Because I plan on using my suppressor a lot, 158 to no less than 147 grn jhp rounds in proven bullet designs traveling at 1050 - 980 fps will do considerable damage within the ranges I will be most likely involved in. I just don’t see where I would ever prefer a fast 115 grn round. I would settle for a good 124 grn if I was out of my 147 grn jhp.

I will be a roving inside safety volunteer where distances will be in feet vs meters. Noise can be nearly as traumatizing to youngsters as the danger and violence they perceive is around them. Hence, the suppressor. The lighter weight bullets are more for speed and penetrating very light clothing. Possible barricades used by assailants could make light, fast bullets ineffective. I would never use high velocity in an indoors, populated environment anyway. 147 - 158 grn jhp at subsonic speeds would also be effective if I am in the outdoors and shooting at longer distances.

You also have to consider the fact that my attitude and past experiences afford me a cooler head and a NON spray an pray approach. My shots will be deliberate and, most likely, up close, center mass or head shots. I have Ideopathic Peripheral Neuropathy in both feet and lower legs. That prevents me from long walking and running any distances other than covering the ground I am standing on or moving to a before hand determined best position to protect the childrens’ church area. The same goes for protecting my disabled wife and any charges I am with during my day or at work. Chasing down bad guys, and leaving my position of responsibilities is also highly unlikely. There are younger bucks for that kind of confrontation. Knowledge of my environment and a prepared mind for confrontation will be my primary strengths. The 147 grn subsonic jhp is my final resort unless there is an active shooter. You can think before exchanging fire and you can think after the shooting stops but when the finger hits the trigger, any decision making has already occured. Target acquisition, clearing a shot and awareness of what is behind the intended target will be what dominates my thinking when the terrorist is shooting. I have a greater degree of confidence in the heavy bullet’s performance in all situations.

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Not always the most important factor is rapid expansion. To cover other present factors more effectively, I choose heavier jhp bullets with proven performance. A 115 grn projectile falls within the adage: A high velocity BB hitting between the eyes is far more effective than a cannonball zooming somewhere overhead. However, I’ve been shot with BBs. I prefer something a little heavier.

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I feel you need to put that into practice if your using that specific of a load out you need to put in the reps with that ammo in those weights with your suppressed pistol, from your concealed shoulder holster otherwise that dance you planned for won’t go well, 147 or 115 you might as well self load you can get exact what you need and how much pop by doing it your self. Good luck , now clearing a garment with a suppressor it can be done , but you better practice your shot placement I say stop shooting silhouettes and use playing cards If you can set up your cards and you move from combat effective to precision shooter and your training should reflect speed and accuracy over anything else you may need a specific type of room where it’s safe to shoot a 360 aka a shoot house. Playing cards need to be set up by some one else so you don’t know what your getting. Set your timer you are blindfolded Or hooded to obscure 100 percent of your vision set timer Start with one card and what ever the value you place that many shots if it’s an ace it’s 3 shot burst Save j q k joker for hostage drills a all shots must be confined within the border of the cards edge of the card is a fail ace cards not hit by 3 shot string is a fail you reload you fail you have to be ready to cook and book you reload at the top of exercises , mag reloads are done after all threats are eliminated you need a minimum mag cap 12 rounds . Have someone film you so you can see where you need to improve . Get a shot timer

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I just watched a YouTube video on gel test of the Super Vel 115 grn subsonic Ammo. I am still a big fan of the 147 jhp, however, now I need to research the pros and cons of the subsonic versions in the type of shooting scenarios I may encounter. As for the drawing and shot placement with a suppressor attached drawing from a shoulder holster is concerned, practice practice practice is exactly what I do. I have been practicing with my S&W M&P Compact 22, my Sig p322 and my PPKS 22all with my Silencerco Sparrow attached from the shoulder rig I will use with my p365 and my 43X after the Odessa 9 has cleared. The Sparrow and the Odessa 9 are of the same weight, diameter and length (5-7 baffles with the Odessa 9). Your idea sounds very interesting. I have found that the point/instinct shooting skills are easier to regain than I initially figured. Drawing from a shoulder rig and drawing with suppressor attached does have its challenges. The front sights are not in any way impacted because both suppressors work beautifully with low factory sights. It’s the balance issues more so than the length issue when it comes to drawing and quick target acquisition with the suppressor attached. Until it is perfected, I plan on my normal carry from the 8 o’clock position with my IWB holster. I’ll master the carry with suppressor skills before too long.

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Five rounds, five yards in a 5" circle in five seconds, from the draw, five consecutive times is a start. It’s harder than you might think and should be the bare minimum of proficiency, especially if you’re taking it upon yourself to protect others.

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Gary, there is no scientific reason per say. I would never opt for such a light bullet dew to personal preferences. I do believe that a heavier jhp bullet will deliver better results especially with the quality of todays bullet technology. The 147 grn jhp (XTP) bullet is a proven “meat eater” or man stopper if you will even though in the +p variant. It is still a proven performer in the subsonic version at 950 fps. The ranges I will most likely be concerned with place this round at the top of the list for my defense round with or without the suppressor. The HST bullet design is another proven man stopper and can be had at standard 1,000 - 1,100 fps velocity to the hyper velocity of 1,200+ fps. We, quite simply, do not need SOCOM performance rounds. Recoil, noise, over penetration and mindset are all geared for over performance that is not needed. I can place 3-6 rounds in a man’s chest, heart, and or head in a matter of less than 2-3 seconds which will end the threat. The proven performance of this bullet at subsonic speeds gives me all the confidence I need so that I can move on to other factors for success like shot placement, steady aim, soft recoil, maintain proper grip and, most importantly my established point/instinct shooting skills with fast target acquisition and quick, controlled follow up shots. At least a double tap if not the prefered triple tap that shuts down a human’s capacity to continue any pursuit is now the attainable goal. Simply put, I do not have any experience with the 115 grn jhp subsonic 9mm round. Investigate the Super Vel 115 jhp subsonic and the 147 jhp performance if you want to. Youtube has a good video on the Super Vel product at: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XR7g2BVREHM&t=328s that could shed some light on this matter. I’ll stick to the FIOCCHI Hyperformance XTP jhp subsonic round until further notice.

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Here is my ammo choice.

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Remember, we are shooting ammo from a 3-5 inch pistol barrel not a carbine. I want heavy, fast enough jhp bullets heading down range in a heavily trafficked area that can handle normal barriers found in rooms without passing through the human or the light barrier and human. I do not trust a 115 jhp to handle a senario the 147 jhp will. I’ll allow God to handle any and all obstacles anyway.

bob

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I’m a fan of the 147 grain XTP bullet. I harvested a whitetail buck with one. It was from a carbine though…

This got me doing further research. I looked at most of the 147 grain hollow points in stock at midway. They were all listed within about 20 FPS of each other. The Remington golden saber bonded was the only one that stated the test barrel length. It was stated as 4”

Underwood has two different +p loads but didn’t state the test barrel length on midway. I believe they do show velocity from different barrel lengths on their website.

If the data isn’t available online and If y’all really want, I could get the chronograph out and test 147 grain loads from different barrel lengths. Last time I checked the only thing significant I remember was the 10” barrel had higher velocity than the 16” barrel. But I was really only focusing my thoughts on weather I was confident that the bullet performance was going to be comparable with other proven loads I had harvested deer with.

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The closest example these guys used was the 147 grain hydra-shock. In the barrel they cut 1” at a time, there was a 49 FPS loss going from 4” down to 3”.

In the “real world” firearms on hand tests they conducted, the Para LDA carry 9 with a 3” barrel was 2 FPS faster than Steyr S9 with 3.6” barrel…

933 FPS vs 931 FPS

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Lucky Gunner has documented a lot of 9mm tests using a 3.5 inch barrel:

I am out of town with only a cell phone to look at the data, but it appears muzzle velocity is lower than the manufacturer advertised for the ones I checked on my phone. It would seem reasonable they will be slower out of a 3.1 inch barrel (13% shorter than test barrel). Since the cartridge takes up part of the measured length, the % the bullet passes through is more than 13% shorter comparing 3.5 to 3.1.

I asked the question regarding ammo choice because I carry a Sig P938 3.1 inch 9mm. I recently bought into the Sig 365 ammo and won’t get my feelings hurt if anyone objectively shows me there are better choices. My subjective observation is there is little to no fire ball indicating most of the propellant is burned in the barrel.

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