I load 28 round 27 is a tracer, when I see that I know mag is empty on a loaded chamber I read some where the lurps in Vietnam did that so you knew it was time to reload.
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Not to address issues with any specific platform here but, in general, any machine I have better function regularly and reliably at it’s stated capacity, and do it out in the real world, not just in the lab or test facility. Vehicle with a cargo rating of one ton? It better carry that ton without excess wear and tear. Pump rated for 5 gal/minute? It better deliver that every time, all the time. You catch my drift?
I keep my weapons clean, inside and out, including the magazines. One came from the factory with 17 round magazines. It functions properly and reliably when loaded with 17 rounds, whether in battery or in slide lock condition. It better. The engineers/manufacturers had every opportunity to determine the weapon’s best state of operation. If the final product can have issues when operated at their stated specs, then they are producing a flawed product and I won’t keep it. (Of course, using third-party mags or off-book ammo is on you.)
Think about it this way: You’re looking at a gun, you really like it and you want to buy it. Then you open the manual and it says that for best reliability you should load it 2 rounds short of capacity. Still going to buy it? Still going to have full confidence in it? If it isn’t completely reliable at stated round capacity, what else about it might be sketchy?
I should probably mention here that none of my firearms are high dollar, top-of-the-line, custom models. Every one that I own is what would be considered a standard model, or even a “budget” model, from a reputable manufacturer. I don’t expect the silky perfection of, say, a Wilson Combat custom piece, but I do expect -demand- that it function properly and reliably within stated specifications. I don’t think that’s too much to ask.
BTW, none of this is meant to apply to the military or any situation where you don’t get to choose your weapon or ammo. In these cases, you just take what you’re given and work with it as best you can.
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This thread has morphed from AR-15 specific, to a discussion about handguns and other magazine feed firearms that have capacities rated at the magazine capacity plus one. I could have missed it but I have never seen an AR advertised with a plus one capacity.
Therefore, it would appear if using 30 round magazine, an AR is designed for either 30 rounds in magazine with empty chamber, or 29 rounds in magazine with one in chamber - a total of 30 either way. If the user never does tactical reloads, then loading magazine(s) to 30 might make sense. If a tactical reload is a potential scenario, then fully loaded backup magazines might induce a life threatening failure.
It reads to me like the instructor who advises only 28 is either conservative or has experienced a tactical reload problem.
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My experience with Mini-14s is exactly that — when loading an open bolt empty gun 20 is 20, and 30 is 30, with easy insertion. Then drop the bolt to chamber a round.
With a round in the bolt-forward chamber, it takes quite a bit of effort to seat the mag, and the brass of the top round is dented in the process. The gun has always functioned fine with that slightly crushed round, but it’s pretty clear that the stated capacity of Ruger and aftermarket mags assumes an empty gun and a full magazine.
Don’t remember whether 5 or 10 round magazines are the same, and know nothing about modern military analogs.
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Heard that myth myself. My father gave me a WWII era Colt M1911A1 that he acquired during a stint in the US Army during the Korean War. My grandfather had kept it for many years and when he passed away my father got it back and passed it on to me. My GF always kept it with a full clip but not one in the chamber. He had only ever shot it once or twice but would get it out every few years and clean it. It sat like that over 10 years at least when I got it. I unloaded it and had it professionally cleaned and inspected. Gunsmith told me that although there was alot of wear on it from handling he would bet that not more than a couple of boxes of shells had ever been shot through it. I asked him about the mag and he is the one that told me not to worry that its a myth. Have shot probably 1000 rounds down range with it in the 25+ years I’ve owned it, with the original mag and it’s never had as much as a hiccup. As it’s not an edc and ever only used at range and as a sidearm when hunting I keep it in my safe locked and loaded so the wife can use it if its ever needed for home defense.
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I have had occasional issues loading on a closed bolt. Sometimes it’s the rifle sometimes it’s the rifle and mag combo. I don’t want to risk having a tap tug and then have to slam and tug again in the heat of the moment so I download with my higher capacity mags.
For handguns I load to capacity. Every round matters a lot more when you are limited to 10-15 and you are more likely to be dealing with a sudden surprise scenario. Plus most of my handguns load on a closed slide without any issues.
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I believe in folk lore, urban myths and the Easter Bunny. Therefore, I do not load my EDC magazines to full capacity.
My EDC is a Glock 19 Gen 4. I carry one 15-round OEM magazine loaded with 13 rounds and one round in the chamber for a total of 14 rounds in the gun. On my belt are two 17-round OEM magazines loaded with 15 rounds each. Remember you are not carrying extra ammo in case you run out but because the magazine in the gun might fail.
For range sessions I use ETS 17-round magazines loaded whatever number of rounds seems appropriate. BTW my GLOCK EDC magazines are never used for range/practice/training after they have been tested for reliability.
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I’ve carried a sidearm for 25 years on and off-duty. I’ve always carried sidearms with magazines topped off to full capacity with one in the hole (+1). And because I am a firm believer of training at the range or at a shoot house the exact same way I would fight, I do the same there. And I have never, ever, ever had a failure because I had too many rounds in a magazine.
Magazine and gun manufacturers do not design, fabricate and distribute millions of firearms and magazines without passing rigorous testing. Additionally, Military and Police contracts demand 100% testing of full capacity magazines. In other words, the US military and all Police agencies are not going to pay for a 15 round magazine or a 30 round magazine just to be told later to have their personnel load those magazines to 14 and 29 rounds respectively.
I’ll put my real world experience and the standards of military and Police Agencies up against a You Tube “Influencer” any day.
Also, no one in a life changing firefight ever claimed that they wished that they had less rounds at their disposal.
Stay safe out there.
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Yeah I think we’re muddling the waters a bit mixing ARs and everything else.
ARs don’t have a stated capacity. They originally used 20round magazines, then at some point 30round became standard, and we have 5, 10, 20, 30, 32, 40, 60, 90, 100 round magazines and drums now. If it were up to me I’d say 100 was “standard capacity” 
For pistols, I don’t typically have an issue loading a full magazine on a closed bolt/slide with one in the chamber. I say typically, because a brand new mag sometimes needs to be loaded and unloaded (the fun way) a few times to get that last round in there.
ARs though… I can’t say it always causes an issue… but I had an issue once or twice a long time ago and heard from enough people who run ARs for a living that downloading 1 or 2 is a good idea so that’s just what I’ve always done. Better safe than sorry.
For those folks saying they don’t have an issue loading a full mag on a closed bolt on an AR, I’d be curious to know…
- Are you sure you are loading a full 30rnd mag on a closed bolt with a round chambered (aka a tactical reload)? You’ve for sure tried it and not just assuming it works it works fine? Tried it means… chamber a round, drop the mag, load a full mag on that closed bolt and then fire.
- What type of mag? Magpul, OKAY/D&H/Brownells/GI, etc
- Capacity of the mag? 20/30/etc
- Anything interesting about either the lower or the bolt/bolt carrier?
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I keep 28-29 rounds in an AR mag, as when I seat a fully loaded 30 rd mag, it takes a bit more force to ensure it is seated and not going to fall out. I also have mags with more than 30 rd capacity, those I don’t have a problem loading to 30.
If you’ve had a mostly full magazine drop out of your rifle, in training it’s embarrassing, but could be lethal in a real defense condition. Try it for yourself, your mileage may vary.
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Welcome to the community @larry201
Welcome aboard @Larry201
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Thanks for all of the feedback. It’s always good to sort out the myths versus practices based on experience.
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Oh contraire, we are purely talking magazines.
Manufactures build the same quality into their long gun mags as they do their pistols mags so the the anecdotes of experiences with pistol mags vs long gun mags is not an apples to orange comparison. If it makes you feel safer with -1 per mag then do it.
Growing up, if you had a car that burned regular gas they would say to run a tank of Hi-Test (Premium) through it to clean it out every now and then. Found out years later that running Hi-Test in an engine designed for regular does nothing except cost you more for that tank of gas.
The point being that there are some “myths” that are ingrained into just about any subject you can think of. When I hear it from a gunsmith that has bought, sold, and worked on literally thousands of weapons I tend to believe him that it’s a myth.
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Oh contraire to your contraire my friend!
We are talking about the specific combination of an AR15 and a fully loaded magazine. That was the OP’s topic/question. As I noted in the comment that you are replying to, this generally does not seem to be an issue with most pistols (at least in so far as I’ve heard). And I’ve never heard of the issue in other types of rifles (like AKs, SCARS, etc), which doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen I just haven’t heard it.
I have heard from people who shoot ARs (and/or MIL variety [M16, M4, etc]) waaaaay more than I have, in much more challenging environments, that loading that full mag on a closed bolt causes more trouble than its worth.
If you have direct (or even indirect) experience with ARs or any MIL variety (M16, M4, etc) that does not exhibit that behavior, I would appreciate if you answered the questions in my comment. That would be more data points to consider if this is an actual issue, or if its a myth that can be busted.
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I spent 20 years in the military and spent plenty of time with the M-16. Granted most of the time is carrying not firing. But the amount of time firing I never experienced a failure due to a max loaded mag. As matter of fact the sergeant that ran the ammo bunkers used to have myself and another friend come to the range periodically when he and his staff were getting rid of ammo that was getting ready to expire to fire it off versus sending to destruction. We would fire off a few thousand rounds each of the old ammo through the M-16, on full auto. Multiple mags (both standard and banana clip) filled to capacity and never had an issue due to mags filled to capacity. Granted, these were military spec weapons, but I would think that if it is such a prevalent issue that owners of these weapons would be pounding down the door of these manufacturers to fix the problem but maybe that’s just me,.
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Did you ever chamber a round, remove the magazine, top off the magazine to full capacity,
reinsert the magazine, and start firing? Did you always empty a magazine before dropping it and inserting a full one?
This thread is about loading a full magazine into an AR/M4/M16 with a round already in the chamber.
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No. never did +1
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I just reread what I wrote and apologize it came off grumpy 
I appreciate your input and your service 
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