We had a lady who was attacked last night at a park near my house. The assailants ( mid-aged woman and man) pepper-sprayed a 19yo woman 6 or 7 times at close range, even as the victim was running away. The assailants drove off long before the police arrived and the police have started an investigation looking for them.
From what I was able to ascertain, the victim saw the couple fighting and cursing outside their car in the parking lot near the park. Their kids were in the car. The victim asked if they could go somewhere else as the assailantās children and other children were around. Probably not the best move, but absolutely within her right to do so. No threats or foul language was used towards the assailants. That is when the couple started attacking.
No one intervened until the assailants left. The 19yo was temporarily blinded for several hours after the incident. I was not there to personally witness this, but it happened about a block from where I live. Iād like to know what would be the best way to handle something like this.
My question, given what context there is and beyond retreat/call 911. What would you have done in the victimās shoes? Beyond what she did, was there a better way to resolve this situation?
What would you have done as a bystander if you witnessed this?
I am just curious what peopleās reactions would be. This one hit close to homeā¦ People are very tense nowadays. I think its good to rehearse (even mentally) and discuss with others what would be appropriate for these kinds of situations.
Stay safe everyone.
Edit: This happened in Texas. Donāt know if that makes a difference, but thought Id mention it.
There was another thread recently where a person (woman?) was pepper-sprayed in a park while having a picnic with her family. Lethal force is not a legally justified action, and now-a-days, sadly, even though the pepper-spray attack is assault, it is unlikely the police would do anything about it. If you struck the person, you would likely be arrested for assault.
How should a woman handle a situation, when she is pursued by two assailants, looking to incapacitate her, and whom she witnessed in combative state before the attack? The assailants didnāt look to repel her with pepper spray, they pursued her, while she was running away, did I understand correctly?
Iād say she would be justified to worry about kidnapping, rape, murder.
You did understand correctly. From what witnesses said, she was absolutely pursued. I appreciate your input.
I think itās a touchy area since pepper spray is a non lethal weapon and is difficult to counter with any justifiable/effective force in return. However, I do agree with you. I wasnāt there, but I could see how she would have (and did) fear for her life. I could see how someone in the wrong place/wrong time would have escalated that much further.
Itās sad what people have come to nowadays. I feel sorry for the young girl. I imagine that was quite traumaticā¦
Call 911. Immediately. Stress that there are children present,
then video and be a good witness, get tag descriptions and usher other children away. Unless I saw violence, you are most likely interjecting yourself into a custodial argument. Something I would not do.
If the couple came after me anyway. Using the reasonable man scenario (which is based off of a reasonable man of my ability AND my disability) I would be in fear of Grave Bodily Harm
(Oonsider I am sitting in a hospital after my 12th back surgery atm).
So I would tell the 911 operator they were not leaving me any other option to defend myself. Pull gun to low ready and give loud verbal commands to desist, while looking for a spot they couldnāt come at me from multiple directions.
Oh and most importantly. DONāT ACCIDENTLY DROP THE MAG FROM MY GUN
PS. Alphabet agency guy who reads my posts this is a humor post the part about dropping my magazine due to a training mishap. Do not attempt this at home. This post was crafted by professionals on a closed course. No animals were hard while this post was created. No funds were accepted for product placement or usage of tobacco or tobacco products.
While she might fear for her safety, this key point is perhaps primary. If you witness someone in a combative state, would you approach and interject yourself into that situationā¦
The first question is, why interject yourself into a domestic dispute, or some argument between two other people? They may be arguing over the custody issues, or one was late to drop off the kids, or they might be arguing over whether they should or should not get ice creamā¦ (there was no indication of what the fighting and cursing was about, or really if it was physical or just verbal, so responding as if it were only verbal).
Next, if there is concern, call 911. Get the tag numbers of the car or cars, if possible and ensure you can describe the individuals and what the fight was about if you can hear .
I would not have jumped into a situation not of my concern. If it escalated, I would call 911.
Once she stepped in, (and this happens a lot with domestic disputesā¦ the police are often faced with both teaming up against themā¦ which makes the Democrats idea of āsocial workersā showing up really sound as stupid as it isā¦), she really has no viable options, she jumped in, and it might be questionable if she can use a firearm to defend herself, though it is an option, as pepper spray can incapacitate you and make you vulnerable to serious bodily injury and / or death.
Should not step inā¦ .call 911 if it appears to be a high risk volatile situationā¦ but arguments are sometimes just thatā¦ arguments.
Does she have a right to demand a stop to prophanity when other children listen? Absolutely.
Should she interject herself into what very well may be a dispute over drug deal (custody battle? LOL, you think too good of people) -I would not.
You probably could cite Michael Drejka case here.
Agreed, but a 19 year old probably wouldnāt have the maturity to comprehend the risk (Sorry Millennials) and probably thought she was mitigating the risk to children by asking them to go elsewhere.
My wife is a Psychologist. She explained why the police send more than one officer to a domestic disturbance. When two people are arguing and a third person intervenes it creates a triangle that gives the arguing people a focal point for their anger. No matter if the intervening person was within her rights, she created the perfect storm for a crisis.
I teach in my class that it is a dicey situation to intervene as a third party. If a person decideds to ādo the right thingā be ready for trouble.
Itās best to call the police and let them sort things out. Thatās what they are trained to do and they have the authority to make an arrest if things go sideways.
