What an interesting question. Do you make note of how many are in the mag you load at the time you load it? As with most people, I suspect, I have multiple mags for any firearm. They hold varying quantities, not to mention partially loading a mag, which I do often. My memory isn’t the best either…
I can relate this to counting gears when on the race track. Up to second gear this corner, down to third at another. I know that this method isn’t foolproof (many bikes now come with gear indicators…).
I think that will play into any self defense situation as well, @Brad. Even with the best memory, the influx of adrenaline will play with our senses and memory. With a LOT of training some of that can be overcome. However, there are no guarantees that you’ll remember how many you shot or how many shots you hear.
@BrophE, @ROBERT27, @WildRose - and everyone else here. Remember why we’re here - to help everyone learn and train. We may learn or train differently, some of us are newer and some of us have more experience, but no matter where we are on our self-defense journey that doesn’t make one person better than another.
I’m totally great with the disagreement here, please make sure you’re being respectful. We cannot learn from each other when respect is lacking - and that lack of respect will chase away those who are here to learn.
Self-defense is not a one size fits all. So disagree to your hearts content, just please keep it respectful.
My guess is it’s the Tacticool guys teaching it so they can spurt out their vast experience to a bunch of people in a class.
Tactical reloads and reloads with retention were meant for instances where there’s a firefight with the enemy or gunman retreating deep into another area or a building. That gives the troops or police time to drop their mag and hold onto it and load a fresh one before advancing (which CCW holders should never be doing), as the threat is far enough away. They have time, distance and shielding on their side.
In the typical CCW scenario, you’d probably find yourself dead if you tried it. Fine motor skills have deteriorated at this point. During a lull in activity, trying to drop a magazine into the same hand you have a replacement mag could end up with both on the ground. If the gunman is attentive enough, he/she may pick up on that and use that opportunity to close the gap or at least continue with the shootout
Never hesitate to ask, the only stupid questions are those that have been answered repeatedly or that were never asked when someone needed the information.
I count. Or I don’t count and use the slide lock visual / click / no recoil instead. Basically I train for both conditions for a couple of reasons:
My eyesight doesn’t adapt focal distance well anymore so switching focus from bad-guy to rear-of-firearm can be quite a bit slower than I can shoot, particularly in low light. So I can’t count on being able to see the slide lock in some conditions. This is why I count.
Adrenaline can absolutely make your brain work differently and focus on different inputs. If I’m running high adrenaline when I shoot, I don’t hear the bang… mine or anyone else’s. When I’ve had to respond in a physical emergency to some situations, I know I don’t process some of what’s happening in the “normal” way I would do it, even when those things are really well drilled in. Knowing that my brain will drop some input data, or short-cut some processes, I can’t rely on counting to work - because I might not have the input available, or my brain may short-cut the counting. For that reason, I don’t count, but use the visual, or the click, or most effectively the kinesthetic signal of lack of recoil as my trigger for either reload or malfunction correction.
So I do both - in either case, I will have put a lot of practice into what my brain actually does at the time, I have two well-worn neural pathways that can be used effectively.
Don’t worry about using your eyes, if you think you’ve hit slide lock or possibly jammed just quickly slide your strong side thumb up and you’ll be able to detect either instantly.
Practice that a little sitting in a dark room or out on the patio at night and see how it works for you.
Give it a try and let us know how it works out for you.
The balance shifts dramatically when you hit slide lock as well, far less typically with a stoppage. When you’ve run through a few you’ll feel the difference without looking and you can just confirm with the thumb slide.
Another difference between LEO’s and civilians is the fact that most state laws regarding deadly force in self defense preclude civilians from waiting around during a lull to re-engage attackers. That would make you a willing participant and not an innocent victim. LEOS’ as sworn officers are required to enforce the law and therefore they are in the fight to the conclusion. In MN and other states you have a duty to retreat or escape if safely possible. Extended firefights with lulls are extremely rare for civilians but more likely for LEO’s. Train for the most likely threats.
Hi @KED, I’m not sure I’m going with the preclude part of that… nothing that I can find in MI or MO law says I must exit at the first opportunity.
That said, if one were to hang out for the chance of getting to shoot more bad guys, I’m pretty sure the next barrage of incoming would be from the prosecutor.
You’d have to consult an atty but in every state I’m aware of that has a duty to retreat that duty extends only to trying to avoid the intial encounter. If you have a lawful use of deadly force it applies through the end once you have engaged as I understand it.
You’re right though, once we engage we have no duty (which LEO’s have) to carry the fight on beyond driving them off or causing them to retreat to a position where they cease firing or otherwise continuing to be a direct threat.
As always consult a local atty and know your state laws and the laws where you plan to visit while carrying.
