When I was in Boot Camp, I will say this much. I was the RCPO for my Boot Camp Company. I absolutely did not want to see a commissioned officer for any reason. Being the RCPO I knew if we saw a commissioned officer, someone in the company would do something stupid and that I would get broke for it and possibly ASMO’d back a couple of weeks.
Do I know that would happen. No, but I had heard a lot of stories about recruit run ins with commissioned officers. I just knew I didn’t want it to happen to me.
I know exactly what happens when recruits run into commissioned officers. Drill Sergeants purposely send entire companies of basic trainees in single file past the officer who dares to wander into their territory. Emperor Palpatine Attempts to climb the Escalator #adultswim - YouTube
That could be what happened. But you absolutely didn’t want to be the RCPO, if that happened with your company.
Though, it may have been a very good thing to do if the commissioned officer had been in OCS and had just graduated and was a fresh, brand new “Butter Bar”
I used to recommend the military service for young men and women who, upon graduating high school, did not have a clear objective in mind. I suggested that it would allow them to gain a few years maturity and perhaps expose them to occupational fields that they did not know exist. I know for me, it did just that. I gained some life experience and found a career that provided me with a fair return for my efforts for 25 years.
Today? Not so much. In fact, I would strongly advise against a military stint for any young person. The military in my opinion is totally screwed up with forced from the top down political correctness. I knew several Navy corpsmen and marines who were, to put it politely, confused about their sexual status. Everybody knew they were confused but we didn’t ask and they didn’t tell and things went smoothly. Personally, I never cared what someone’s sexual preferences were as long as it wasn’t jammed in my face. I had and still have a phrase that expresses my opinion which I won’t repeat here. It involves a deviant male practice and animal sodomy involving barnyard fowl and I will leave it at that. I don’t care what floats your boat. I just don’t want it shoved at me. Keep it to yourself. If you are a close friend and in need of some very personal advice, I will try to the best of my ability to help but you have to remember I am not a licensed psychotherapist. If you are barely a casual acquaintance, STFU. I don’t want to know. In fact, I don’t even what to know about your “normal” sexual activities. I grew up with the notion that gentlemen just don’t discuss such things. It is detrimental to the honor of the ladies involved and does nothing to enhance the reputation of the supposed gentleman who discusses such things. I know, I am old fashioned, but to me there were some things about earlier ages that are worth emulating even today.
That bothers me as well. Also why I said Generational
Damage . If you know anything about career officers who want to make rank past O-5. You attach your career to higher ranking officers who can help you. So as an O-5 you are learning all the things that those who went on before you learned to get promoted.
So it will take a generation or 2 before you got all of this woke ideology out and that’s saying we reset the military at all. Which would probably take a couple of Republican POTUS’s. I have always supported the enlisted I give that freely. Officers past O-5, that’s an entirely different matter. As I have known them, were entirely different animals.
What I said up above has been MY experience. I am not saying every O-5 and above is that way. But I have known to many that were entirely to political.
Well said.
No one has to like all the bull they’re throwing at our armed forces. But stop blaming the military. They answer to civilians, and we elect those civilians.
I don’t know how many here remember @Zee. Her husband taught classes for the USMC at 29 Palms. He had some really disturbing things to say about the Boot camp
He said alot of them didn’t know what an illegal order was.
Not bashing anyone. Just relaying a piece of information .
History should not be obliterated. Just because you don’t like the story doesn’t mean it is not without value to others. It is important to not let the truth stand in the way of a good story.
Since I have said repeatedly, that I believe that veterans point of views were not sad. Being as I am a veteran from the Boomer generation.
I agree, that an officer attempting to order me to CONFISCATE anything on CONUS during 1982 to 1990. Would be problematic. Seeing that Posse Comitatus is still the law of the land.
I merely mentioned, that someone I knew who interacted with current USMC recruits, had said he was surprised that USMC recruits did not know what an illegal order was.
When I went through boot, illegal orders, UCMJ, were day one week one, classes.
We may have taken an oath, but we were still bound by lawful orders from superiors and the UCMJ.
That’s why I feel, when TSHTF, they will just be following orders! We saw it live when they took up posts around the capitol building, they would have stopped any American from entering!
The military has always been loyal to the “governors” than to the governed!
The oath is pledged to protect the nation, not individuals! Just look at Hurricane Katrina, gun confiscation, violence against civilians. Kent State was just the beginning in our country!
We may have to distinguish between what is a lawful order and an illegal order! There’s a total disregard for “posse comitatus”.
If I remember correctly, all orders must be obeyed. If there’s a question, it can be challenged later. Under oath, we do not get to pick and choose our fights!
Personally I would have the same problem with the same order to confiscate or harm my fellow citizens!
If I remember correctly, all orders must be obeyed. If there’s a question, it can be challenged later. Under oath, we do not get to pick and choose our fights!
I’m thinkin there are some orders that are so wrong they can be refused on the spot…
the biggest problem we have IMHO is that so many of our younger folks have no real moral base anymore
they have NOT been educated on how to reason and think… just indoctrinated to do as told…
Only lawful orders must be obeyed, according to Article 90, UCMJ.
We beat this to death in another topic, a while back. The short version is that while service members are required to obey orders from their superiors, that only includes lawful orders. Service members can be held accountable for following unlawful orders. In other words, “I was just following orders” is not an excuse for committing an illegal act.
Service members of higher rank tend to be held more accountable than those of lower rank.
All that is true, our generation had a good moral and ethical base, we clearly understood right from wrong. A generation of mindless pot smoking lazy anti American juveniles are more likely to become mindless robots! In addition boot camp is becoming woke camp! We are on our way to becoming a very weak and dangerous “force”. That danger is not to our enemies but to our own people!
If we look at today’s military, no one is being held accountable.
PRONOUNS, PRONOUNS, in the greatest fighting force since the Spartans!
Tomorrow, all orders will be illegal, unethical and immoral!
We were also lead by superiors that had a similar moral compass. Today you add the Dot Com mentality to the Gubment Check generation and you’ve got a generation with the “this is easy because someone else is going to do it” mentality.
