Both my Virginia CCW & Utah CCW were up for renewal this year. I live in Virginia. Virginia renewed my permit, no problem. Utah denied me due to a “new law” that requires applicants to prove they were not involved in domestic violence.
I pled guilty to “misdemeanor assault” in 2007 due to some horrible advice from my court-appointed lawyer. (There was NO violence involved and it involved a towing company). When I received my Utah CCW in 2017, it was not a problem. It is not a problem in Virginia either. But now, Utah wants me to prove I did not commit domestic violence.
So, I contacted VA State Police records and my local County Police where the conviction occurred. There is no arrest report, since I was not arrested for the incident. I cannot “prove” something that did not occur. Yet, the Appeals Agent denied me. He is basically judging me guilty until proven innocent, contrary to U.S. law.
Anyone have some thoughts on this matter? They kept my $25 of course. Should I just apply at a different state for a non-resident CCW? I’m looking for carry reciprocity.
THANK YOU!!
Welcome to the community.
I am not a lawyer and none of my response is intended to serve as legal advice.
You did plead guilty; ergo, you were convicted. It doesn’t matter if nothing happened.
That’s what is leading Utah to request more information before granting you a non-resident permit. They’re not going to do the legwork, so they can’t tell if your misdemeanor assault had a domestic violence component without your providing it.
Another state for non-resident CCW? All Utah is adding (if my eyes are right…they aren’t, always) is Washington state, Delaware, and Nevada. If one of those is the reason for the Utah permit, have you tried those states for a non-resident permit?
Try Arizona instead.
My UT five-year permit is expiring in 2 years and researching if AZ or FL is better.
I’m from Utah, I think this new law thing must have something to do with the new constitutional carry laws we past here this year. All I can say is good luck.
Like @OldGnome Not a legal beagle and welcome aboard.
Would the charging document, transcript, or plaintiff provide proof that it was not “domestic violence”?
Defined as:
- Physical abuse of a household member, especially one’s spouse or domestic partner.
- Violence against another in an intimate relationship such as marriage and dating.
- violence or physical abuse directed toward your spouse or domestic partner; usually violence by men against women
Assault: Utah law defines assault as follows:
76-5-102. Assault — Penalties.
(1) Assault in Utah is:
(a) an attempt, with unlawful force or violence, to do bodily injury to another; or
(b) an act, committed with unlawful force or violence, that causes bodily injury to another or creates a substantial risk of bodily injury to another.
(2) Assault is a class B misdemeanor.
(3) Assault is a class A misdemeanor if:
(a) the person causes substantial bodily injury to another; or
(b) the victim is pregnant and the person has knowledge of the pregnancy.
(4) It is not a defense against assault, that the accused caused serious bodily injury to another.
Criminal assault charges are ripe with defenses for many reasons. First, the complaining witness who assaulted you often is not a savory, kind, or upright citizen who is going to show up in court at the trial, even under a subpoena. Second, these complaining witnesses generally have criminal records where they will be impeached viciously by your criminal defense attorney.
Good luck!
Maybe the Utah def. of “assault” is a problem. In Virginia, the violent part would be “battery” and assault is simply inferring that one may do something. So, my charge was changed from “assault & battery” to “misdemeanor assault” because no violence occured.
I find it very interesting that with the same facts, Utah approved the permit the first time, Virginia approved it again this year - yet Utah denied it this time even though nothing changed.
I wonder if some anti - 2nd amendment Dems got elected in Utah and are intending to restrict licenses?
(p.s., I meant to reply this one to George98)
Thank you all, btw
Maybe I should look into Arizona. Because I did provide the hard-headed Utah appeals agent with transcripts of the case (which did not mention “domestic violence”) and he still denied the renewal permit, because it didn’t state I did NOT commmit domestic violence. It didn’t mention that I didn’t commit murder, or arson either! 
It’s sort of like:
“You’re guilty of planning to destroy the sun!”
-Huh??
“Well you cannot prove otherwise, can you?”
Gotta love bureaucracies where your rights sometimes have more to do with whose desk your paperwork ends up on than what the regulation actually are. I have to get approved for a lot of my work on a per project basis. I have had the same bureaucrat approve me for one job then deny me for the next. So sometimes it depends simply on if they are in a good mood or not!
The only issue with the AZ permit is that you loose WA. Though you gain NM.
It sounds like typical CYA.
i now live in florida but at the time i lived in pa. i had a del. permit , pa., and fla. which i got through the mail after submitting all my ccw permits and shooting exp. and a life member of nra . fla. was very easy to get through the mail and easy to renew . if you have any other permits submit them to fla. and you might get a fla. permit . good luck and GOD bless ralph d.
That would stop you in Indiana too.
Is Reciprocity the reason for having more than one CCW permit?.
pardon my butting in, but in a way. Not really reciprocity, but ability to carry in the states that do have reciprocity with the states you’re permitted in. Utah permit has reciprocity with a lot of states, so I added that to my CT permit so I can travel west, then I added FL which added NM and FL to the states my Utah permit allows carry in.
https://www.usconcealedcarry.com/resources/ccw_reciprocity_map
Rodger that. Thanks
Reciprocity would eliminate the need I guess
bingo…and the fact that more and more states are going constitutional carry both helps and hurts. Utah is going Constitutional, so some fear other states may not honor the Utah permit come January, but we’ll see. Personally, I don’t think it will keep some from honoring Utahs permit, as well, you got a permit, and took that step beyond simply going with what our forefathers created.
Quite a few years ago states started sharing Drivers lics info. What was going on in the days before that was. Truck drivers and any other person who had racked up a lot of tickets and such could go to neighboring state and get another Drivers lics there. Years ago I heard of someone who had dozens of licenses. This is a little off track but the discussion brought it to mind
Just an addition to that. Very unlikely that would happen today due to the info sharing. Those seat warmers in DC need to get off their 6s and pass reciprocity
still a lot of variation with getting a ccw permit, depending on the state. In CT, the Utah permit requires a class, mainly going through the laws, but no shooting or prior training requirement to get a non-res permit. Florida didn’t require a class, application was on-line, then mailed in prints done at P.D., and certification of training, funny as though I submitted my NRA pistol training from 6 years back, my NRA safe hunter training from 1970 would have sufficed…though sadly, I seem to have misplaced the documentation in the 51 years since passing that course lol.
Let’s hope. Several years ago with the stroke of a pen the AG in PA removed the recognition of Utah unless it was a Resident CCW.