# Untraceable Ghost Guns

**URL:** <https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/t/untraceable-ghost-guns/16458>\
**Category:** Guns\
**Created:** [November 25, 2019, 12:00am UTC](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/t/untraceable-ghost-guns/16458 "2019-11-25T00:00:04Z")\
**Posts on this page:** 1\
**Showing post:** 25

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**Author:** ![Dave17](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/community.usconcealedcarry.com/dave17/32/15053_2.png) [@Dave17](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/u/Dave17)\
**Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 3:29pm UTC](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/t/untraceable-ghost-guns/16458/25 "2020-06-10T15:29:37Z")

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I know this is old, and I addressed this issue with you on another thread, but, like I am now, if someone is reading this later in time, I feel the correct information on “home-made” firearms should be included here.

One is legally able to sell firearms that are “home-made”. It is not legal to be unlicensed and be in the business of manufacturing and selling firearms. [https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/does-individual-need-license-make-firearm-personal-use](https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/does-individual-need-license-make-firearm-personal-use) Further, on that link it states “In addition, the making of an NFA firearm requires a tax payment and advance approval by ATF.” That would mean that one is also legally “allowed” to manufacture NFA items, but not machine guns, will need a tax stamp (prior federal approval) to do so legally. Also, I have not found anything on the ATF site about the requirement to put a serial number on a home-made firearm before it is sold. [https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/how-can-i-make-and-register-nfa-firearm](https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/how-can-i-make-and-register-nfa-firearm)

This information on what is required/suggested when transferring a firearm in a private transaction: [https://www.atf.gov/file/58681/download](https://www.atf.gov/file/58681/download) It does not mention that a serial number must be on the firearm. I could find no citation requiring firearms previously manufactured for personal use requiring a serial number when transferred.

This site states that a serial number is not required when transferring your home-made firearm, but I could not find a valid link to the ATF where it is specifically stated, except when discussing licensed manufacturers: [Are Firearms without Serial Numbers Illegal? - Pennsylvania Law Abiding Gun Owner Blog](https://www.pennlago.com/are-firearms-without-serial-numbers-illegal/)

One other irony of our arms laws I just found while researching information on the ATF site, a Q&A fact: “Are muzzleloading cannons considered destructive devices?”

Generally, no. Muzzleloading cannons manufactured in or before 1898 (and replicas thereof) that are not capable of firing fixed ammunition are considered **antiques** and not subject to the provisions of either the Gun Control Act (GCA) [https://www.atf.gov/rules-and-regulations/gun-control-act](https://www.atf.gov/rules-and-regulations/gun-control-act) or National Firearms Act (NFA) [https://www.atf.gov/rules-and-regulations/national-firearms-act](https://www.atf.gov/rules-and-regulations/national-firearms-act). [26 U.S.C. 5845; 27 CFR 479.11] Last Reviewed April 20, 2020”

[https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/are-muzzleloading-cannons-considered-destructive-devices](https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/are-muzzleloading-cannons-considered-destructive-devices)

So, an old operational cannon, that I would believe no one would claim to not be capable of horrific destruction, is not defined by the ATF as a destructive device, but a breach-loading cannon, regardless of size (apparently), is a destructive device. One has to love government logic.

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