# Need an alternative to M17 **URL:** \ **Category:** Guns & Gear\ **Created:** [April 15, 2023, 10:07pm UTC](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/t/need-an-alternative-to-m17/90887 "2023-04-15T22:07:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Crockett](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a87d85/32.png) [@Crockett](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/u/Crockett)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2023, 10:07pm UTC](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/t/need-an-alternative-to-m17/90887/1 "2023-04-15T22:07:10Z")
Planning to move on from my P320 M17, but can’t find an alternative with the features I want. Looking for a 9mm striker-fired with a 4-5" barrel, thumb safety, and a 1 piece trigger. Only things I’m finding that come close are S&W M&P 2.0 but not thrilled with the trigger, or the Walther CCP but the barrel is a little short. Anyone know of something I’m missing that has these features? ---
**Author:** ![Craig6](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Craig6](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/u/Craig6)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2023, 10:36pm UTC](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/t/need-an-alternative-to-m17/90887/2 "2023-04-15T22:36:52Z")
Springfield XD was made with a thumb safety for the military trials but I haven’t seen one of them in a long time. Cheers, Craig6 ---
**Author:** ![James589](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/3e96dc/32.png) [@James589](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/u/James589)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2023, 10:56pm UTC](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/t/need-an-alternative-to-m17/90887/3 "2023-04-15T22:56:52Z")
I had a Walther CCPthat could not be made usable… The trigger was unusable. If I were you I would not even consider the CCP ---
**Author:** ![Crockett](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a87d85/32.png) [@Crockett](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/u/Crockett)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2023, 11:01pm UTC](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/t/need-an-alternative-to-m17/90887/4 "2023-04-15T23:01:41Z")
Thanks for the insight. I was really taking a close look at the CCP. ---
**Author:** ![Jamey1](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/community.usconcealedcarry.com/jamey1/32/16491_2.png) [@Jamey1](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/u/Jamey1)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2023, 11:24pm UTC](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/t/need-an-alternative-to-m17/90887/5 "2023-04-15T23:24:37Z")
I really like my M&Ps. The trigger is a non-issue for me. And i believe the magazines for the P320/M17 are compatible. ---
**Author:** ![Crockett](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a87d85/32.png) [@Crockett](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/u/Crockett)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2023, 11:59pm UTC](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/t/need-an-alternative-to-m17/90887/6 "2023-04-15T23:59:02Z")
My wife has a Shield EZ and I really like that gun, but want something with a little more capacity. Maybe it was just the M&P I dry fired but it had a really long take up and felt a little gritty . ---
**Author:** ![Scotty](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/community.usconcealedcarry.com/scotty/32/13706_2.png) [@Scotty](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/u/Scotty)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2023, 12:02am UTC](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/t/need-an-alternative-to-m17/90887/7 "2023-04-16T00:02:54Z")
Just my opinion… The one piece trigger is going to be the issue. Again, just my opinion, but it’s my understanding that most if not all striker fired pistols have two main stages of trigger pull. The first is the mushy take up, which moves the firing pin safety out of the way. The second is the break, which releases the sear. Older designs like Glock and Kahr include a slight pullback of the firing pin as well as moving the firing pin safety in the mushy take up stage, hence why most of the newer designs have smoother triggers (no extra firing pin cocking during the mushy take up stage). Trying to find a striker fired pistol brand that is willing to forgo the inertia safety on the trigger is going to be hard. Most manual safety single trigger piece designs are going to be either DA/SA or SA hammer fired, each of which often come with safeties (not always). The SA only pistols are usually designed to eliminate the mushy take up stage, and many consider that a plus. Most DA/SA (or DA only versions of DA/SA pistols) usually have what feels like an extra long DA or a mushy long DA (IMO the plastic DA triggers seem less precise than the aluminum competitors). Unfortunately, the closest things I can think of that replicates the mushy take up with a single piece trigger would be: 1. Tracking down a used Sig P250 with manual safety… although I don’t remember how far the reset is. IIRC, the trigger was relatively light for a DAO pistol. I also don’t know what parts are compatible with the p320. 2. HK USP with an LEM trigger kit installed while keeping the safety of the original configuration. However, this is still a hammer fired pistol, has a higher bore axis, and I don’t know what happens if you push the safety into the decocking mode position. FYI, installing the LEM trigger is a pain in the butt, especially if you’re like me and want to install the stronger trigger return spring. ---
**Author:** ![Shamrock](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/community.usconcealedcarry.com/shamrock/32/24612_2.png) [@Shamrock](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/u/Shamrock)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2023, 12:11am UTC](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/t/need-an-alternative-to-m17/90887/8 "2023-04-16T00:11:41Z")
My understanding is that the M&P 2.0 triggers are noticeably better than the 1.0 triggers. But I haven’t tried one. If you like the M&P but Can’t get used to the trigger you could always throw in an Apex Trigger. What is it about the P320 M17 that has you wanting something different? ---
**Author:** ![Crockett](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a87d85/32.png) [@Crockett](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/u/Crockett)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2023, 12:20am UTC](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/t/need-an-alternative-to-m17/90887/10 "2023-04-16T00:20:17Z")
The whole unintended discharge issue has me a little concerned and I haven’t found anything that says the modifications that the Army requested resolved that particular issue (not the drop discharge, the later unintended discharge issue) or that there haven’t been any unintended discharges of the M17 specifically. My grandson shoots with me and uses that gun so I’m being a little hyper cautious. Also losing a little confidence in Sig Sauer and their whole handling of the issue. ---
**Author:** ![Crockett](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a87d85/32.png) [@Crockett](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/u/Crockett)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2023, 12:27am UTC](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/t/need-an-alternative-to-m17/90887/11 "2023-04-16T00:27:36Z")
I see that’s a new offering in the Sig line-up. Only drawback is the barrel length. 3.7" is a little shorter than what I’m hoping for, but I will probably take a closer look anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Shamrock](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/community.usconcealedcarry.com/shamrock/32/24612_2.png) [@Shamrock](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/u/Shamrock)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2023, 12:28am UTC](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/t/need-an-alternative-to-m17/90887/12 "2023-04-16T00:28:30Z")
Understand the hyper caution when family is involved. I haven’t heard of any issues with the P365 family that @Enzo_T pointed to. I have had the original P365 for a few years now without issue and am really happy with it. ---
**Author:** ![Crockett](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a87d85/32.png) [@Crockett](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/u/Crockett)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2023, 12:31am UTC](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/t/need-an-alternative-to-m17/90887/13 "2023-04-16T00:31:04Z")
I’ve heard nothing but good things about the P365. The barrel is just a whole inch shorter and with my vision I need that extra sight radius. ---
**Author:** ![Nathan57](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/community.usconcealedcarry.com/nathan57/32/37700_2.png) [@Nathan57](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/u/Nathan57)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2023, 12:37am UTC](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/t/need-an-alternative-to-m17/90887/15 "2023-04-16T00:37:10Z")
For awhile at the beginning at least there were all kinds of widespread P365 concerns. Primer swipe, barrel peaning, strikers breaking in half, trigger return springs breaking, excessive barrel wear, etc probably more that’s just off the top of my head (and yes I previously owned one of them and experienced two of that list myself)…one of the most problematic recent releases I can think of (and effected more than just the first one, future ‘upgraded’ versions had additional problems) It also seems like a striker fired with a one piece trigger and no dongle is how you get the P320 situation where the pistols actually fire by themselves/without the trigger being pulled. No need for a manual safety on a properly designed and built striker fired pistol. I personally recommend just getting one of the dime a dozen strikers with no manual safety, or if you want a more complicated manual of arms, get a traditional double action with a safety and a decocker and spend your time at the range training to try to always know what condition the gun in (striker is pull trigger bang, no pull trigger no bang, KISS) But, I am clearly bias ---
**Author:** ![Shamrock](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/community.usconcealedcarry.com/shamrock/32/24612_2.png) [@Shamrock](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/u/Shamrock)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2023, 12:42am UTC](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/t/need-an-alternative-to-m17/90887/16 "2023-04-16T00:42:54Z")
> [@Nathan57](#): > > It also seems like a striker fired with a one piece trigger and no dongle is how you get the P320 situation where the pistols actually fire by themselves/without the trigger being pulled. I haven’t heard of that issue with the P365. I did hear of all the other issues you referred to which is why I waited to buy one until a year or so after they were released. I think they got all the kinks worked out. I haven’t heard of issues with the later runs and haven’t had any with mine. ---
**Author:** ![Nathan57](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/community.usconcealedcarry.com/nathan57/32/37700_2.png) [@Nathan57](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/u/Nathan57)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2023, 12:45am UTC](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/t/need-an-alternative-to-m17/90887/17 "2023-04-16T00:45:10Z")
Later a relative term, still looking at the first year or two, more of a general trust to sig’s QC and level of caring that the 365 had multiple issues across multiple ‘updates’ as it went, right after self firing P320’s, and now there are things about kabooming P320’s out there too ---
**Author:** ![Crockett](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a87d85/32.png) [@Crockett](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/u/Crockett)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2023, 12:47am UTC](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/t/need-an-alternative-to-m17/90887/19 "2023-04-16T00:47:56Z")
Just had a Holosun 507C put on my Staccato and your are correct. Vision problem solved. I shoot some events that are iron sights only so of course I’d like to have another gun just for that application. 😁 ---
**Author:** ![Crockett](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a87d85/32.png) [@Crockett](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/u/Crockett)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2023, 12:51am UTC](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/t/need-an-alternative-to-m17/90887/21 "2023-04-16T00:51:22Z")
I’m pretty old school and maybe a little anal about the desire for a manual safety. Also, all my other pistols that I have or hope to all have manual safeties and I’m trying to be consistent across all my platforms. ---
**Author:** ![Nathan57](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/community.usconcealedcarry.com/nathan57/32/37700_2.png) [@Nathan57](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/u/Nathan57)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2023, 12:58am UTC](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/t/need-an-alternative-to-m17/90887/22 "2023-04-16T00:58:08Z")
Same, and there was something to it with partially supported .40 chambers. ---
**Author:** ![Jerzees](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/community.usconcealedcarry.com/jerzees/32/111382_2.png) [@Jerzees](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/u/Jerzees)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2023, 1:44am UTC](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/t/need-an-alternative-to-m17/90887/23 "2023-04-16T01:44:03Z")
I would still consider M&P 2.0. If you are not satisfied with a new trigger you always can go with Apex Trigger which puts the pistol into a higher level. The only disadvantage of M&P is the weight. I actually got rid of it because of that. They released a metal frame too late. 😐 ---
**Author:** ![Crockett](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a87d85/32.png) [@Crockett](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/u/Crockett)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2023, 1:54am UTC](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/t/need-an-alternative-to-m17/90887/24 "2023-04-16T01:54:36Z")
The M&P is the leading contender. I think I’m not giving the trigger a fair chance. Did you think yours was too light or too heavy? The one I held had some heft but I like a little weight to my pistols. [Next page](https://community.usconcealedcarry.com/t/need-an-alternative-to-m17/90887.md?page=2)