Also many of us, even in relatively pro-gun states, have state laws that force private transfers to go through an FFL for a NICS check. To lie on the 4473 is merely a bureaucratic speedbump, the real problem is simply that using or possessing Marijuana is a federal crime.
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Completely agree for multiple reasons, and I’ve supported legalization in multiple states. The one good thing that could come out of the Democrats controlling the presidency, house, and senate would be federal legalization.
In the meantime all of us have to make an unfortunate choice, particularly as it relates to medical marijuana. Smiddy is pointing this out for how legalization is supportive of veterans. I will tell you as someone getting up there in age that chronic pain is something nearly everyone will have to deal with at some point in life. The number of people I know who have found marijuana useful for that pain, without the side-effects of narcotics, is growing dramatically. And they mostly use varieties grown (or edibles formulated) to have a higher CBD:THC ratio so there isn’t the high that a recreational user seeks. I would really like that option available to myself, and other people who happen to own firearms, at whatever point in the future we might need it.
Once I got over the shock I decided to forego my usual cleaning & secure my own weapons, in my vehicle as opposed to the dwelling. Fully compliment, no. But as I was staying there, with my family, for the night it was the best option I had.
Like I said- all around uncomfortable…
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Yes, no doubt it is. And when the “young pups” here get to that point, they will be much more interested in, and supportive of, such things as MM that get that pain relieved I’m willing to bet.
IMO, def the Feds need to get it off the restricted level it is on, remove it as a crime to have around/with firearms, and figure out a way to determine if someone is unfit while using it to have a firearm on them. They got to and thru a Covid vaccine quick enough they by George ought to be able to figure out a test to see if someone is too far “gone” to have a firearm on their person.
As for the storage in same place issue, that is pure bullcrap. If one of my family needed and used MM, under my roof where they already lived, then by God nobody in LE or government should have anything to say about my guns if it is not I who am using the stuff.
Lastly, let’s not forget that opium comes from poppies, which grown outta the dirt like Marijuana. Opiates have created a crisis that marijuana never could. Two different animals, but both are more natural remedies than come from pharma manufacturers. Personally, I’m opiate tolerant, so opiates do not work for me, except the direct line I have going from a pump to a spinal nerve root. In my bloodstream it doesn’t do jack. Am willing to bet that if one fine day it were legal, that MM would not hit me like it does others either, simply because my liver has had the workout from hell for so very long. I had a dentist, while pulling a tooth, tell me my liver was metabolizing the novacaine too fast & he couldn’t legally give me more, then explained my liver metabolizes such faster than most due to its history of metabolizing very strong pain meds…
All I frickin want is a chance to be without pain, while awake, one more time before the day I die, hopefully many years from now. I do NOT wish to say, well, they never legalized it, but I was so good at gutting pain out I just did.
Screw that.
Lastly, I do not think ppl whom have no experience with severe or chronic pain need comment on this topic as it relates to such. Until you been there, you just do not know. In the past I’ve literally felt like a trapped racoon who would chew its foot off to escape a trap…there were times 30 years back when I literally considered simply using my miter box power saw to cut the damn hand off…what stopped me was twofold: 1. Self harm I believe is sinful 2. A neurologist had told me that it would hurt whether amputated or not
That’s the kind of stuff I’m talkin’ about that needs better solutions. I have no desire to recreate with MM, only be without pain for once, since 30 years ago, and I think it possible if our government gave a hoot and tried.
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Well, we are all entitled to our own opinions, whether or not anyone else, including you agrees, but I do understand your sentiment. I have no issue with you, nor anyone else, using what they believe helps them. I do not believe possession, nor use, of any drug, in and of itself, should be a crime. A crime occurs only if you harm someone else, either physically or through loss of their property.
I do empathize with your condition, and fully agree that Marijuana should not, as I believe all drugs should not, be a crime for possession and use. Neither should it be a crime for possession and/or use of a drug and be in possession of a firearm. If you are not harming anyone nor their property, what crime was committed?
@Dave17 I think I came off incorrectly with that statement about ppl commenting. I def agree everyone is entitled to their own opinion, and we all have the freedom of speech.
My concern with any drug is its abuse…as with someone who drinks too much and endangers the public by driving. That could be analagous to too much medicinal marijuana and handling a loaded firearm. This is, IMO, why medical tests need to be done to figure out how to determine when someone using MM is too affected to carry firearm, drive, whatever. I can NOT believe there is not a way that can be figured out. And when it is, it also needs to be removed from the list of controlled substances at the Federal level. My God, the potential new ATF director would have a field day with this one too. Let’s hope the guy doesn’t get the job. I don’t recall the name, but got a “take action” email from BFA today, and of course I did sign on to their email to my representatives.
Anyway, I do apologize to all for my “don’t comment” statement. I should have said that unless one has dealt with severe, intractable pain, it would be hard to understand where I’m coming from on this issue…
Blessings & Ya All Take Care,
Use of a drug, even being under the influence of a drug, should not be a crime either. We all know that it is unwise to be under the influence and drive, use machinery, firearms, etc. The only criminal aspect of use of a drug is if you harm another or damage their property. The issue with medical testing is that it predetermines an amount that is then stipulated as the “limit”.
As we have seen with alcohol, that limit is continually reduced; I believe most states it is 0.05%, which means if you drink a beer, you are legally under the influence. I had a friend that was t-boned at an intersection by another driver, who was not drunk. My friend tested over the limit. He got arrested, the guy that hit him went free. The other driver was 100% at fault - totaled both vehicles. Fortunately, none of us got hurt. My friend’s “driving under the influence” had no bearing on his being rammed by what we politely call a distracted driver. He worked in night clubs and was not even visibly intoxicated. He passed the coordination tests, but failed the breathalyzer test.
I am in no way suggesting one should be driving, etc., when intoxicated, high, whatever, just that a measurement of drug level is not indicative of someone’s actual impairment. Unless you harm someone or their property, cause a public disturbance, etc., I do not see where someone should be charged with a crime.
Understand and agree. The issue though, with the Fed, seems to be they won’t legalize it, as they should, because there is presently no way to determine how affected a person using MM is.
That said, I can have 2 bourbon + cokes per hour for an entire evening and walk perfectly straight, shoot straight, and know when/how to handle my guns. I simply wish the Feds would get a grip on the MM thing.
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Unfortunately in the lawyer-controlled world we live in, no one wants to risk waiting until tragedy strikes.
It’s all about prevention. Which is why the younger generations seem to have such a hard time with life.
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Which generation you callin’ “younger”? Gen Z I presume? I’m a Gen X’er. I have 2 kids. One behaves like me, the other like the sadly typical Gen Z crowd. Anyway, the “younger” generation seems to have a hard time navigating a typical crosswalk from my perspective.
But back to the entire point, MM IS indeed helping people, and is a valid medicine in a lot of our states. I simply pray that the medical use is recognized, and the Feds keep their regulatory habits out of the way long enough to not cause the right to pain treatment be an issue with the right to keep and bear.
What it seems is, they’re simply not interested in helping people. They do, however, sure as heck wish to remove folks’ rights and property.
I therefore conclude that, there is not enough money in MM for our government to give a crap. It would also conflict with their relationship to Big Pharma if God forbid MM replaced any of their synthetic pills.
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coke, as well as marijuana, have in the past been legal in the USA.
The “social experiment” of deeming them illegal as a control measure for the general population is, well, just that, a control measure.
I could easily and legally get drunk enough that I cared a lot less about my pain, but it would remain present. I think it possible, however, that did it not conflict with 2A, I could possibly get actually pain relief from MM. I’ve seen it happen for others first hand, those who have been in pain many many years…maybe not the 30 I’ve endured, but still a decade or more of pain puts them in my category. It therefore causes me to believe that, since they had pain for 10-15 years, took opoids for it, then MM relieved the pain and they no longer take any oral meds for it, that perhaps it would be something that allowed me to get the morphine pump out of my abdominal cavity, and the catheter from it outta my spinal column. Already have leftover metal pieces up there, would like those to be it one day.
And lastly, OMG, what a joy it would be to spend one fricking hour, hell, even 5 minutes, without pain after all this time…
Let me phrase it for the government types in order they may understand, if ever it needs repeated:
“I identify as a pain free individual. It triggers me when I hear that MM could possibly help but then I couldn’t carry my guns. That would remove my safe space. It’s not fair. I deserve extra compensation until this mess is straightened out and you mean people figure out how to alleviate my physical pain without breaking laws.”
How’s that? Seems close to the phrasing of those who get their “special” treatments nowadays, maybe I should start writing my representatives in this manner. More likely though, I’ll not waste my time beating my head against another wall.
I’m in the tail end of X or beginning of Z depending on who you ask & when they think it changes.
Put another way, when I was in school there were 1st, 2nd, & 3rd place trophies and that was it. A 56k dial up modem was the cat’s ass, & cell phones made phone calls and that was it.
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While I empathize with your pain, I think you are deluded about the nature of MJ…and now cocaine. I have spent the past decade and am now committed for the remainder of my life to cleaning up other people’s messes…yes, veterans’ messes…and ignoring my own aspirations and wants for the sake of the human beings marijuana and painkillers and benzos and psychotropics (all started with a little harmless weed) and alcoholism nearly destroyed. I’m talking most of all about 2 beautiful little girls born into a family destroyed by substance abuse. My wife and I both live with chronic pain and permanent disability from combat and non-combat military injuries. We have been in pain mgmt, had multiple surgeries, been in cognitive therapy for pain, taken acupuncture, done yoga/taichi/meditation, taken opiates without becoming addicted done hydrotherapy and physical therapy numerous times, and taken the “modern” so-called pain meds that are actually psych drugs all on doc’s orders; and we have rejected everything beyond OTC NSAIDs and the occasional anti-spasmodic. So I walk a different direction on the same path, brother. I’ve followed along and participated in this thread since it began, reading everything you and others have written. And I refuse to be around anyone with loaded firearms who is under the influence of alcohol or illicit drugs. I have been on specops with people who were taking prescription opiate painkillers without a problem. Anyone caught with THC in their system was GONE. Period. And all of that happened for very good reasons. Don’t fall for all the propaganda. I’ve watched “just a little weed” destroy several families and numerous otherwise decent and respectable people.
That’s my 2 cents. Peace! May God be with you.
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I don’t think anyone was suggesting cocaine should be legalized. Only that it had been in the past. Along with opium derivatives, Marijuana, and pretty much everything.
I’m glad to hear you were able to take prescribed meds as prescribed and not get hooked. But you are the rarity. This is why the Sackler family just paid $700bn to avoid a trial. I have witnessed many ppl with no prior drug use, some who didn’t even drink, who fell into the “my doctor said as needed for pain” trap. The lucky ones were able to get into a rehab program. Most either OD’ed, took their own lives, or turned to Heroin and are now incarcerated due to the crimes they committed in order to not feel pain.
My best friend in the world was a Navy SEAL who lost his life to opioid addiction following a Line of Duty injury. I struggled through that with him from 1993 to 1998. So tell me something I don’t know…up close and personal, that is.
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I am sorry for your loss. Empty platitudes we’ve all heard too often I know…
Your previous post came off as lacking empathy. As has been said in many threads, it’s hard to get nuance in text.
Addiction is a terrible thing. To many people lose their fight with it, in one way or another. It’s good to know it can be beaten & doesn’t always end in tragedy.
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@Ken38 I certainly can understand your position(s) on this topic, and I respect them as well. However, what I do have is my personally witnessing, and therefore proof of MM helping someone near and dear with chronic pain that I saw opoids and other therapies not touch. She is literally pain free for 7 months since starting medical marijuana. Pain FREE.
Now, I do not know how it is in other states, or much else, but in our state, one gets a card for a qualified condition, then goes through a dispensary to get the MM for use in a vape, edible, and there’s some sort of heater device that is not a traditional pipe that may be used for bud. However, the thing I have witnessed was via vaping.
I am well aware of the dangers surrounding opoids and misc other pain treatments. I have had a pain management dr for around 25 years. 3 failed spinal cord stimulators, and 3 morphine pumps later, the best I can get on average of that damnable 1-10 pain scale is 3-4, which will sometimes hit a 9, depending on use of my injured body part, the barometer, or for no apparent reason at all.
Let us get a little more personal as you request, though I couldn’t tell who that was directed towards.
I have run the gamut of pain treatments from motrin (VA morons), anti-seizure meds, opoids, and everything in between. None worked. I do not continue taking things that do not work, including when my pump was out due to a surgical infection from replacement, for 6 months, and I had not a damn thing that helped, including the Opana prescribed by the pain dr. I would try a dose or two, take the almost full bottle back to the next appointment, ask could they do no better. They’d repeat, then I would as well. As I understand it, the same building where my pain clinic is houses a rehab, and those folks would have probably used the hell outta the Opana. I disposed of it via my local pharmacy. As I said, if something does not help, I do not take it again. It seems that for me, only IV morphine, and now the targeted to the nerve root intrathecal morphine, at under 0.8mg/24hrs is the only thing that works for my pain, and I’ll repeat here, caused by a line of duty traumatic burn injury.
During my journey with pain management folks, I’ve run across more than one who thought I was a pill seeker, some who thought I was actually over using what was prescribed, yet, they were all incorrect. That is the way they have been conditioned to look at us vets because so many do abuse, as does a large number of the civilian population.
I am willing, if it remain necessary by law, to gut out the pain with which I still deal that remains with the morphine pump, as the pump is the best treatment I’ve had thus far. However, I do not believe or support the opinion that since some abuse, we are all prone to doing so. I am not. And I will never use anything that endangers my 2A rights. Meanwhile, I await my country, whom I served when I incurred this still painful injury, to get their collective heads outta their rumps and those rumps in gear so that a man such as myself at least has a chance to live pain free as I did before serving my country. If that means adjusting laws, doing studies, or whatever else, then so be it. But damn, it ain’t like I’m asking them to legalize shooting up heroin or something. The effects of MM are quite impressive, and the risk of addiction I believe is negligible and more related to individuals’ lack of self-control/discipline, than it is to the not overpoweringly strong high of marijuana. Not like it is LSD, shrooms, Angel Dust, coke, etc. MM is, best I can tell, at its worst, maybe as strong as several drinks.
Perhaps I’m different than a lot of ppl, no, probably I am. But I did have the traumatic burn injury, I did use my rifle, not just carry it, and I have PTSD, and multiple items that fall under a depressive disorder umbrella that I will not discuss online. For these, I have a therapist.
The pain and PTSD both qualify for a MM card in my state. I can not, however, get one else it would put my name straight into the NICS database, and proceed to screw up my gun rights. Unless and until that changes, I have no choice but to gut out pain incurred by serving the country who tells me that some states have MM that might help, but if you opt for pain relief, you lose your guns. I ain’t the one…
Lastly, I have no desire for “just a little weed.” I have a desire to try to legally and properly attempt to get pain relief from MM whenever that may be possible, if it ever is. I would also like my countrymen to encourage our leaders to do the research on it for vets like me who are in pain, and many of them in more than I.
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Not sure if I missed it, but have you tried any of the CBD products? The are required to have <.01% THC, are available OTC, and supposedly that’s what helps with pain, anxiety, appetite, etc…
Also, if you are a ‘letter of the law’ guy vs spirit I’ve been seeing things in my news feed regarding a synthetic Delta 8 THC. It’s too new to be regulated so not illegal. But also no rules on how it’s made or with what… Not sure about the details/ side effects/ cost /effectiveness and so on.
My service connected pain rarely goes above 4 so I can’t imagine not being below.
As always- Safety first & good luck.
You obviously didn’t actually read my previous posts in this thread before declaring me lacking in empathy. It’s okay. I’m quite used to it at this point from strangers and some addicts. There are even a hand full of combat vets alive and happy today who once called me a cold-hearted jackass who just didn’t understand what they were going through. But you know what? I was THE GUY who was there with them helping them fight their way out of the holes they dug for themselves and/or the military/VA dug and threw them in to die. I honestly don’t care about the Peanut Gallery. I care about the FEW who are worthy of my empathy and my help. I have lived in a tent in the West Texas heat at a rodeo arena next door to a disabled combat vet’s house while I led the volunteer studs-up rehab of his home while he fought off a prescription drug addiction perpetrated by the VA, and while raising the $30k for materials. He, his wife, his parents, and their 2 beautiful young children don’t think I lack empathy. But a whole bunch of his battle buddies from his unit in Iraq called me all sorts of names in order to excuse their own lack of support for their brother. The people of his town don’t think I lack empathy. Neither do the couple of his battle buddies who actually showed up to do the work. Coincidentally, it was because of “just a little weed” that another member of his unit scammed the $$$ from them to buy that most of the folks from his unit were so skeptical and resistant to helping out.
I got over the critics who never do the actual work a looooooooong time ago. Now I’m going to go play ball with my 2 year old adopted drug-baby daughter I sold everything I owned and moved to Florida to rescue from the drug dealers she was traded to by my sister-in-law’s baby daddy. This country is chock full of uncles, aunts, grandparents, etc. who are raising other people’s damaged kids because of “just a little weed.” 2 entire generations of children trashed by a sympathetic attitude towards drug and alcohol abuse. Sin is sin. It all has consequences. Quite often, those consequences are suffered as much or more by OTHERS than by the person who commits the sin. Most folks have no tolerance for truth anymore. I am intimately familiar with ALL of this, because I do not ignore it, make excuses for it, hide it from view. I confront this dragon head-on whenever she rears her diabolical head and I try to repair her damage as best I can. Because…you know…I lack empathy.
That’s me in blue and the boonie hat on the left. Roaring Springs, TX; 2016.
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