For the Christian

@Sinbad your link brings up 2 relevant results:

  • Commandment 6
  • Christian Self-Defense - John chapter 8

Which one were you thinking?

Thanks for the reply!

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The point of my post was as follows. I apologize for being unclear.

  1. @Michael661 posted that Jesus’s words in Luke 22:36 to buy a sword had applications for us to buy a gun today.

  2. @Max20 stated he disagreed with Michael’s interpretation of that verse.

  3. I was pointing out that there are serious biblical scholars who agree with Michael’s position.

The audio file I embedded is the first link at the Monegism link I provided which is titled Commandment 6 Self Defense and Firearms. It is a talk by Wayne Grudem who is a theology professor. I think we could label him an “expert witness” on theology. He argues for Michael’s position that Jesus’ suggestion of buying a sword applies to handguns in our day.

I included the broader Monergism link because I didn’t like the direct embed of the audio file. I wanted interested readers to see the context of the source I referenced.

I hope that’s helpful. Thanks!

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For a different perspective, see here.

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1 Timothy 5:8 (NKJV) “But if anyone does not provide for his own, and especially for those of his household, he has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.“

There are a lot of verses in the Scriptures that talk about the right to self defense, and others have shared some good ones. I read an excellent article on this a while back and will try to find it later. It’s a long and very detailed study on this subject. In the mean time, the verse above is talking about providing for one’s own household. Providing doesn’t just stop with food and shelter. It also includes providing protection for the weak and vulnerable. And if you were to become disabled because you refuse to defend yourself, who would provide for your family then? It’s one thing if you’re not able to support your family, but if you make choices not to, you’ll have to give account for that one day. I hope this doesn’t come across as a criticism of anyone, because that’s not what I intent it to be. For me, the choice is clear. Protecting my family is part of providing for them.

As always, please search the Scriptures for yourself. There are so many verses on this subject, and you’ll get much more out of studying the Bible than you will from a group of strangers on the internet.

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The hope that is in us, is in regard to everlasting life. Self defense is for protecting one’s self in this life. Both are valid.

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The need can change, so thanks for offering. Our team includes both members with weapons and members with only a phone and radio. Both types can be useful in time of need. For instance, one unarmed person to approach someone protesting a worship service to invite them to come out and chat as the service continues, and someone else in the background safely ready to respond to any threat that develops.

One other point made recently by our team lead is that he wants to know who all is carrying in church, even if they are not on the team, so no one mistakes them for a bad guy in a time of trouble.

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Since my only, limited, exposure to Christianity has been the LDS church I’ll offer up Some Mormon Stuff about Self Defense:
From the LDS-Preparedness Manual -

Defense
“People who live in delightful, well-mannered suburbs,
who never have to contest for their lives and property, often fail to grasp the subtle logic of violence. It is a mistake seldom made by hardened criminals.”
James Dale Davidson and Lord William Rees-Mogg in
THE GREAT RECKONING"

"In a massive social collapse, most people will be able
to keep only that which they can defend. This includes
their lives, their homes, their food, their money, and
if they’re male, even their wives and perhaps their
children. "

“An individual has rights only as long as he
can defend them. This is the subtle logic of violence.
It has always been true but it’s something to which
most of us have never given a moment’s thought. It’s
also a concept that makes some Saints uncomfortable
because it contradicts much of the illusions by which
we have lived all of our lives. However, unless you
understand and accept this basic fact of life, you may
not survive the coming challenges”

“It may save your life. Why? Because
it’s not just having a weapon that’s important, or
even knowing how to use one; it’s knowing full
well why you need to use it and therefore not hesitating to use it when needed. A gun in your hand is totally worthless against an assailant unless
you’re fully willing to use it to defend yourself.
You must understand that the new rules
brought on by a major disaster may require
you to defend your life personally.”

"The other useful weapon for home or personal
defense is a handgun. Although an automatic
shoots faster and loads quicker than a revolver, it
is a more complex mechanism and may jam occasionally, whereas a revolver almost never jams. Also for a novice, a revolver is less intimidating
to hold and shoot. "

“If the gun is for a small female, the .357 may be
too heavy and awkward to use effectively. In that
case a .38 or even a .32 may be a better choice.
Remember that a smaller caliber weapon does not
have the stopping power of a larger one, so if you
have to shoot someone to defend yourself, keep
shooting until you empty the gun. Once you’ve
wounded someone, he’s going to try to kill you
if he possibly can, so you don’t want to inflict a
minor wound; you must stop him!”

“Finally, there is a cardinal rule about guns that should
always be kept in mind:
Never point a gun at someone unless you are
completely willing to shoot.
If your assailant senses hesitancy, he’ll move quickly
and take the gun away from you. Your life may depend upon this so it’s essential to accept it completely.
Go back and read the opening paragraphs above.
In a disaster the rules have changed; understand that and you will survive; fail to understand that and you will perish.”

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There a lot of one liners that can be pulled out of that article and all of them true. You must have the mindset that you will shoot and do violence to another person in order to save yourself and others. Think about it before hand to prepare yourself but it never matches what it will do to you in real life.

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This is an excellent YouTube by a Christian woman. Well worth the time to watch. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Ykwp6VZmK8

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Bookmarked to watch later. Thanks for sharing.

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Hello and welcome @Ann14

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Welcome to our Community! We are glad to have you.

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Welcome to the family @Ann14 and yes I have seen her videos. :+1: :+1:

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I trust in God. But God gives us all free will, and I do not trust in mankind. People do terrible, evil things. I think Bruce’s meme is spot on that you can’t just pick a verse here or there because it’s too easy to twist it into anything you want. But from the beginning, mankind took on a sinful nature when Adam and Eve first sinned. Cain then killed his brother Able. You can see the evil that men do all throughout the Bible. You can see it all throughout history.

When I was younger and living alone, my Christian beliefs made me a bit of a pacifist. If someone decided to end my life, shame on them, but I’m going to Heaven. I frequently went shooting because I enjoyed it, but didn’t own a firearm yet (I used range rentals). That changed when I was dating someone and her ex-boyfriend broke into her house with a rifle intending a murder suicide event. We escaped, but the police didn’t have him in custody and I was up all night because there was someone out there who was armed and wanted us dead. My entire focus was on how to protect her. It was shortly after that I bought my first handgun because I never wanted to be in that position again. I didn’t buy it to commit evil acts. I bought it to protect people I love from the evil that men do.

And while Jesus preached against a strict interpretation of “an eye for an eye”, He also said,
Luke 22: 35 Did you go in want of anything, when I sent you out without purse, or wallet, or shoes? 36 They told him, Nothing; and he said, But now it is time for a man to take his purse with him, if he has one, and his wallet too; and to sell his cloak and buy a sword, if he has none. 37 Believe me, one word has been written that has yet to find its fulfilment in me, And he was counted among the malefactors. Sure enough, all that has been written of me must be fulfilled. 38 See, Lord, they told him, here are two swords. And he said to them, That is enough."

The sword was not to wage war against the Romans, but for defensive purposes. He was warning them that people would want to commit evil acts against them for preaching the Gospel. Self defense and defense of loved ones is legitimate. And if you’ve ever been in a situation where someone wants to take your life and/or the life of someone you love, you’ll find that self defense is also hard wired into our DNA. It’s instinctive.

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All evil needs to succeed is for good.men to do nothing.

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That’s one of the things evil needs. But there are other things, like corrupt DA’s refusing to prosecute criminals, corrupt judges handing down slaps on the wrist instead of tough sentences, and let’s not forget, parole, and early release. Now, corrupted police depts. are arresting and letting perpetrators go. Oh, and the lack of any national boarders isn’t helping us either. And after all of that, the corrupt feds, and governors are still trying to eliminate our God given right to possess and carry firearms, not to mention all the other God given rights we have. They still must be afraid of us. That’s good but how long will it last?

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Well done and the greatest verses like these are
needed.

The Situations that these people that lived in those
Priceless Times were in wartime; before or after.

King David is a beautiful place to start. Research
and prayer is needed. Many People have seen and
been in wartime.

In our time we face war after war, our enemies seek to destroy. Our Military Men and Women have trained to
fight and many have lost their lives too.

GOD has never stopped or does HE sleep and you can
trust HIM in any area of HIS Written Word and show
You the Reasons.

Being armed and training all the time is a big responsibility, but GOD is the help and protection to stay away from dangerous problems. GOD can stop
any problem before it starts

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You can read in God’s word time and time again where God gave the Israelites victory over their enemies, even though God gave them the victory over their enemies, they had to take up arms and fight against them.

The bible says Jesus Christ, the same yesterday today and for ever more.

I believe and trust in God with my whole heart, I believe that we as God’s children are given the right to protect ourselves against evil and evil people.

Brother Ron

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AMEN brother @RUGER9 :pray: :pray:

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