Disappointed in the USCCA

Lucky you :slightly_smiling_face: I’m jealous :innocent: I love his books :star_struck:


Yeah, I’m with you @Dawn. I read the original as urging everyone to get training, even vets, and I don’t see any advocacy for mandatory training for anyone. Here’s what I wrote to Rick on his post:

“I was airborne for three years and never even formally trained on a handgun. I’d sure know what to do with a fully automatic long gun, a squad of colleagues, and air support if needed, all of which, as you point out, is all but useless in civilian life. Since getting my CCW permits, I take courses pretty regularly and find them exceedingly useful. To my mind, anyone ought to train up for the tasks at hand, vet or no. Thanks for writing!”

I also strongly disagree with the premise that USCCA should only post views that we all agree with. This is one of the forums I most value PRECISELY because of the civil disagreements going on here. I learn a huge amount from this forum, mostly from views I had not been exposed to or thought about.


I second the comments about anyone, including veterans, getting as much training as possible. As a retired USAF weapons instructor I can verify that mot all military people get the same level of firearms instruction. For some it’s just the basic while others get very advanced training. It all depends on your specialty and mission tasking.


I guess my 2 tours in combat trained me rather well, on that note, I think ANYONE whos seen combat as a Veteran has a lot more experience than those who haven’t been deployed and stood in the line of fire.

Tomorrow is always kinda hard on me as to the fact it’s a yearly reminder. A reminder of all the horrors I’ve seen, all the brothers I’ve lost, all the blood I’ve shed and all the brotherhood I felt. But it also proves that I’ve made a difference in some lives.


Lot’s of truth here. Unless you’re in special operations military firearms training tends to be very basic and really does not give a foundation for the civilian or even LEO world.

About the only things that really transfer well are firearms safety and shooting fundamentals.


Veterans Day and Memorial day are both always somber reminders for me.

Whatever issues I’m left with as a result of my service I made it home and remain relatively functional even though I’m approaching 60.

Many did not.

I always use those “holidays” as an extra reason to reach out to the families of guys who didn’t make it home and to vets who came back “broken” physically, emotionally, or both.

“Thank You For Your Service” sure beats the welcome the Vietnam Era Vets received when they got home but I encourage everyone to make it real, go out of your way to help a vet that needs it or the family of a vet that didn’t make it home.


Totally agree with everything you said, I always tell people that I didn’t do it for thanks, I did it pt of patriotism. I gave some blood, sweat and tears, but my fallen brothers gave all and they deserve a lot more thanks.


Well, the truth is that a CC class can only teach you the basics, but learning the law and learning to shoot is a life-long pursuit. It is also true that being a former military member does not mean one knows the laws of the state one retired in regarding self-defense and firearms, nor necessarily being a proficient shooter. Even many LEOs do not know firearm laws well, nor handle firearms proficiently - proven, unfortunately, almost daily. I also could relate at least several personal observations to bear that out, too.


The one vet shouldn’t say anything he should be glad he got cccw without taking a test not gripe about it dont make sense

He is welcome to express his opinion, @Belmont. Training when you carry a firearm is critical for your defense and to keep others safe when you’re defending yourself.


Hi Dawn your right i just dont agree i got my CCW permit without the training i had to take a hunters safety course when i was 16 i know when i need to use my gun i know I’ll hit my target

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I’ve come in contact it’s other vets that are anti gun. It’s not the fact that they are antigun that bothers me so much. It’s that their psyche has been twisted enough for them to espouse unconstitutional beliefs inspite of their oaths. Psychiatrically I can understand after combat the desire to not be involved with firearms. That’s personal. But to espouse it publicly in favor of legislation and unconstitutional controls is unconscionable imo. The 2A is in truth a control on government, not the people. :+1: I’m not disappointed because these are the conversations that must be had. Here or anywhere. Especially on a public platform.


Being raised in a military family, I’ve seen those effects in both my father and brother. Welcome Home Brian, thank you sir. Took my brother over 20 years to rotate back to the world. I was honored to be there to help. Happy Veterans Day sir. You are loved, especially by those of us who have experienced the pain that you feel in a home setting. :handshake::heart::us:


I equate the average CC/LTC course to driver’s ed we took in HS.

Nobody is really ready to be a competent driver after just completing DE and earning their license.

Even those who are skilled shooters and have been around firearms their whole life are not really going to be competent after just completing the basic CC course.

I see very few truly responsible people getting comfortable with carry until they’ve been carrying for several years and have had significant training above and beyond their CC course.


Why is that? He recognizes that military service alone does not prepare one to be competent, confident, and to carry responsibly.


Did anyone prevent you from improving your skills with a firearm or knowledge of self defense law?

Did you choose to educate yourself on the subjects most critical to anyone lawfully carrying?


Unfortunately oaths have little meaning to many people anymore. They simply mouth the words because it’s required.


I spent six years three active and three inactive and never fired a pistol or was taught to but I was taught to fire a rifle and was good at it. When my wife and I took our conceal and carry class I took the first night with her but didn’t have to because I had DD214 but I learned a lot at that class so I don’t think every veteran should get his permit without taking the classes.


OK Gentlemen, I’m stepping in and calling a halt to the religious discussion in this thread as it is off the topic of the thread. If you’d like to have that discussion, start a separate thread.

The official USCCA position on training:
The USCCA acknowledges the importance of training and encourages all of its members to seek out and obtain quality training from knowledgeable instructors. At the same time, the USCCA believes that excessive government requirements for training are often used as barriers to entry for those who would wish to carry a firearm for self-defense. The USCCA believes it is the responsibility of every armed citizen to know and follow the laws concerning legal self-defense and that government agencies should make that information readily available to all citizens.

The Community welcomes all opinions as long as they’re expressed respectfully. I understand that you won’t agree with everyone someone else has to say - and that’s OK. But please remember, we’re all here because we want to improve our ability to defend ourselves and our loved ones.


well said @Dawn :+1: